[Little Red Dun]

What's so bad about promoting your stallion's color?

I don't necessarily mean on this board, but often times I've seen people get treated pretty poorly because they have a stallion that is an uncommon color at stud. Now, I understand that color is the LAST thing to worry about with a stud. Conformation, and disposition come way, way before color. However, if your stallion does have color going for him, why is it a bad thing to promote that?

I mean, honestly if I had two studs to choose from that were identical in terms of correct conformation, excellent disposition, and good performance records, but one was 'colorful' and the other was 'plain'. I would breed to the 'colorful' one myself, as long as the color was accepted in the breed (not like chestnut Friesian, etc.). Color would be the last thing on my list, but again, assuming both studs were equal in all other ways, I would pick 'colorful' over 'plain'.

So, why are people so quick and harsh to judge 'colorful' stallions? Why do they act like it is such a bad thing to promote a stallion's color if he has color going for him?

[cassidy]

i dont think so as long as he ticks all the right boxex an has colour as a bonus then sure i see no problem with adding that as an extra bonus

many people like a stud to be good but also have a great sucess at throwing colour

although i do have to add i do hate it when people advertise their stallions on a colour basis an you see that he isnt stallion material at all

[LotsOfSavvy]

I have absolutely no problem with a stallion owner promoting their stallions color. I certainly do! My boy has a great disposition, good conformation (at least I think so) and will throw at least 75% color if it turns out he doesn't have the dun gene (only way to know FOR SURE is to progeny test). He hasn't shown yet but he will as soon as he is broke to ride.

There are plenty of stallions in my area who advertise solely based on color and disposition. Paint people and people with Cremello/Perlino horses do it all the time. In fact, a lot of the stallions advertised this way haven't been shown. They have good conformation but no show record so the only thing they can go off of is their color. My stallion is in the same boat. Without a show record, his color is is main asset.

Color and a show record to me is the great combination for a stallion. Winning offspring an even better one! This year I'm breeding only about 5 mares to my boy. Get some foals on the ground (three will be mine, ~ 2 outside mares) and then send him to be started by the local cutting/reining trainer.

The truth is if a mare owner wants to breed her mare she will. If they care about color they'll pick a stallion that can produce it. In my case, if she has good conformation for her breed, I'd rather her breed to my stallion.
But I'm not going to be breeding any ewe necked, parrot mouthed mares either.

Just my opinion.

[Vix]

I think people are so quick to judge someone marketing a colorful stud because there are so many out there (just like the breeders we were talking about that breed for fads and not quality) that are just trying to market a color, not the animal itself. I've come across quite a few Cremello TB studs that were not at all something that screamed stallion quality to me, to the point where I've thought to myself that the boy should have been gelded a long time ago. I agree if you had two identical stallions within a breed that were equally nice in temperment, confirmation and ability to throw offspring that carried their lines, I would go for the 'bling' too.

It's not bad to promote color.

It's bad to promote only color, the same way it is bad to buy a horse based only on color or to breed a horse only based on color. A unique color is great and if that's all someone wants then that's up to them, but while they're busy staring in awe at the white coat, I'm going to watch out for the hoof lifting itself to kick them in the head when the horse has a bad temperment.

That's not to say I'm never swayed by color, everyone has their ooohs and awwws over an interesting coat, but after that minute is done and I evaluate the rest of the horse, if temperment and conformation doesn't made the horse an overall beautiful picture? I'd rather go for the plain chesnut standing next to it that has the most important qualities.

[Little Red Dun]

I see what you're saying. I certainly think a stallion needs more than a 'bling' color. All the color in the world is useless if its on a long-backed, short-hipped, ewe-necked stallion.

It just seems to me that some people are three times as harsh on a stallion that is 'colorful' than one who is not. I've seen people put down a 'colorful' stallion and say he should be gelded, etc. etc. but in another thread compliment someone on their 'plain' stallion that doesn't look any better to me than the 'colorful' one. That's what confused me.

Edited to add: LotsOfSavvy, your stallion is a gorgeous boy and I've never seen a color quite like his. Can you break down his color a little for me? I'm trying to wrap my head around it. So he's Homozygous Black + Cream + Dun + Roan? Does he have Agouti?

[CowGirlUp1833]

I have no issue with people promoting color AS LONG AS its not thier #1 selling point. If the horse has amazing color but poor conformation, temperment, health and bloodlines....then GELD HIM! I HATE when people think just because a horse is flashy that it makes him stud-worthy. It does not.

thats all

[Vix]

Originally Posted by Little Red Dun

I see what you're saying. I certainly think a stallion needs more than a 'bling' color. All the color in the world is useless if its on a long-backed, short-hipped, ewe-necked stallion.

It just seems to me that some people are three times as harsh on a stallion that is 'colorful' than one who is not. I've seen people put down a 'colorful' stallion and say he should be gelded, etc. etc. but in another thread compliment someone on their 'plain' stallion that doesn't look any better to me than the 'colorful' one. That's what confused me.

Sometimes people's reactions to a stallion comes from how a breeder first presents their stallion. If they start right off the bat saying their stallion is amazing, the best stud around, and has a $10,000 stud feed just because he is colorful? That right there would be enough to turn me away if I had a mare I was looking to breed. I would rather see someone present their stallion's confirmation, their performance, their offspring etc FIRST before they ever mention color...sell the stallion on what he can do rather than what color he is. If all of that is there, then add in that his color is an added bonus rather than his only feature.

I understand that there is a HUGE pool of stallions one can come across when looking to breed so you have to make an add or a presentation stick out somehow but to me, seeing someone advertise based soley on color does nothing positive for me.

[Little Red Dun]

Originally Posted by Vix

I understand that there is a HUGE pool of stallions one can come across when looking to breed so you have to make an add or a presentation stick out somehow but to me, seeing someone advertise based soley on color does nothing positive for me.

I can see that being a problem. If all they talk about is his color you start thinking they are hiding something or he just doesn't have anything else going for him, even if he does.

[Acme Acres]

There's nothing wrong with promoting color, but you darn well better prove yourself first. I know of a gal who buys all the "latest and greatest" trying to make them into gold when she sells them and reaching on pedigrees for accomplishments. But then for example, Horse Breakers here in Arizona breeds just for Buckskin QHs and they're known nation wide for it. We've chosen to breed just duns/dilutes in our paints, but you can bet the horses are going to have a pedigree upclose, they're going to be correct and foals are going to be shown. Big difference. To stand a stallion at x amount because his color is rare for that breed is redicilous unless he's proven himself that he is deserving of having that type of stud fee.

[LotsOfSavvy]

Originally Posted by Little Red Dun

Edited to add: LotsOfSavvy, your stallion is a gorgeous boy and I've never seen a color quite like his. Can you break down his color a little for me? I'm trying to wrap my head around it. So he's Homozygous Black + Cream + Dun + Roan? Does he have Agouti?

He's EE / Aa / NCr / Rr and could possibly have the Dun gene making him Dd. The Dun is questionable. He still shows very mild striping on his legs (after body clipping) and you can still see a dorsal looking stripe a good four inches to his tail. Because there is no DNA test for Dun the only way to know for sure is to progeny test to non-dun mares. Until then I'll call him a dunskin cause he's registered as a dun.

He also has a GREAT temperment. You can lead him right in front of mares that are trying to get him in THEIR pants and tell him to ignore them and he will. You can tell him to tease them and he will. He can be turned out with bred mares / geldings and is safe enough to be handled by anybody. Never bites or attempts to bite. Loves to be cuddled. Just an all around good boy.

I let people form their own opinions about his conformation. If I didn't like it I wouldn't have bought him. BTW here is a recent picture taken last weekend just after he was body clipped. I am working on getting him fit to show halter. His first open show is the end of this month. Im still debating on taking him to the local AQHA show (previous years there have been no stallions in the stallion class apparently...just going to be a waste of money if we are the only ones in the ring). He's an August baby so he's not quite 2 1/2.

Edited to add: He also has stripes down both sides of his ribcage...if you look close enough you can see em. Just noticed them when we body clipped him but went back and looked and they are there on his summer coat too...I think that is pretty cool!