Not Your Typical Ending Slaughter Thread

Sandra-A1 · 01-11-2006, 12:04 PM

No problem here MyBabyTex....I understood your first post and had no problem understanding the point you were trying to make.
I do agree that we need to not only enforce the regulations that we already have in place but also need to work toward improving the farming/ranching that produces the beef, pork, lamb & poultry that feeds the nation.

Pennymercantile, if it is the Humane Society of the United States (HSUS) you are referring to in your post..... I think I would check out them out a bit more before I gave them my full support. They seem to be changing their direction and becoming more like PETA when it comes to their direction and goals.

If you would like you can start your research here: http://www.animalscam.com/organizations.cfm

Shotgun93 · 01-11-2006, 12:06 PM

Okay - truce.

I agree with your message, animal rights should be better. I have seen a change in the way animals are treated pryor to slaughter in feed lots and where they are raised. But, I haven't seen a change in transportation.

My message is that people shouldn't believe everything that they see. Yes, those pictures are real, but they are taken out of context. They take pictures when the animals are brought in off the trucks, after being in cramped spaces for up to 48 hours straight. Of course the look desheveled, they are tired, hungry and dehydrated, and depending on the time of year, extremely hyper or hypo thermic. They are crammed into holding pens while awaiting to be sorted into bigger pens where they can be fed and watered. That's when the pictures are taken, right after the bring them in. Or when they are in holding pens in the facilities that they come from, awaiting to be loaded, or vaccinated, or moved, weighed or any number of things. The point is, they are not treated like that 24/7.

And a lot of these groups make the general public believe that is the way they are treated constantly. I never said that you personally said that, but many groups do. And, the thing that drives me nuts about PETA is how they take things like that video and tell every one that will listen that every plant is like that. If they copped up to the fact that it was just THAT plant, maybe people could do more in trying to stop that particular plant. Instead, they say it's every plant, confusing the truth.
They came here to protest a rendering plant and played that video over and over, screaming about how awful slaughter is. The thing is, that plant in particular doesn't even slaughter animals. They just clean up the by-products from other plants and make bone meal for animal food companies. They labeled that plant as a horrible place that kills helpless animals, when they don't even touch an actual animal. If they had taken that time and money and spent on Halal, maybe something good could be done.

So, back to my original point. Yes, things do need to change. They have changed so much in the past 10 years, but there is always room for improvement. To me, the biggest problem is transportation, and that's what needs to be fixed. And, knowing what context images like the ones plastered all over the net were really done in, can do much more for stopping the problems than pulling on people's heart strings and mis-educating them.

Kiwi Pony · 01-11-2006, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Equine_Harmony

I have read the other side menaing pro slaughter, I am learning from them in a nice way why they are pro slaughter, this helps me, educates me. I just got my feet wet not to long ago about horse slaughter and I am honest, and not rude like you. If you want to get your point across to me or anyone in the future yes, bring on the facts you hold but give respect as well for people will really hear or read into what you have to say. and BTW: this is not a thread about horse slaughter. I was told by the poster and respect this poster.

I did not mean to be rude... my post was straightforward, yes, but I do not see (nor intended) any rudeness?

I know it's not just about horse slaughter, but the bits I wanted to respond to happened to be about horses. I accept that you hold a different opinion, and that's fine. I was hoping perhaps you might elaborate on some of those points so that I could better understand it.

Kiwi Pony · 01-11-2006, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kiwi Pony

So what? To be blunt, the world does not revolve around America, nor does (or should) everyone else set their standards and culture by the USA's.

I hope no-one from the USA was offended by this, by the way. It was not meant to be anti-USA, just pro-world

Circle C · 01-11-2006, 04:31 PM

I agree that the slaughter house animals should be treated better.

I honestly don't see a big deal with horses being slaughtered. No, I would NEVER send one to be slaughtered, but we eat cows, sheep, calves, lambs, rabbitts, squirrels, turkeys, chickens, blah blah blah. The list goes on and on. What is so defferent about a horse? We can ride them....we can ride cows too. They can think and be trained.....so can cows (I've seen cows that can do amazing things). Honestly, what is so different about a horse? Nothing IMO. A horse is an animal, a piece of livestock. Whether you decide to eat it or befriend it is your choice.

No, I wouldn't eat a horse, but I can't say I'm against some one else eating one.

My Points: It's sad, yes, that healthy, unwanted horses are being sent to the slaughter houses, but so are other animals. I'm not against or for slaughtering horses (or other animals). I eat meat. Slaughter house animals should be well taken care of, not abused like you see all too often.

Lou3 · 01-12-2006, 02:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyBabyTex

This video was taken at a KOSHER facility. It says so on the video!!! I don't trust the videos PETA has taken before because they are decades old (Which I have said a FEW times in here) and this one is from 2004 and shows in detail the atrocities still occuring. Doesn't matter if it is in a Kosher facility or a Halal facility, bad **** is going down and we are all relatively powerless to stop it. But we can try.

The thing is we dont REALLY know if it is even a real facility. Knowing how PETA work they could just as easily have set the whole thing up themselves as false propaganda or filmed it in a developing country, or a country we know has a poor animal welfare record.

cowgurly02 · 01-13-2006, 10:42 AM

Quote:

This thread seems to be jumping around a bit...so I will try to post as per the original post #1.

As far as I know..and have personally seen...slaughter houses are VERY regulated. There are provincial sanitation inspectors and provincial vets that pop in in suprise and scheduled visits. our government is very interested in what we are being fed, and with all the insane things like bse and avian flu...they are not taking any chances.

Same goes for feedlots. Having worked for a vet who specializes in herd health specifically for cattle feedlots...you would be suprised how much time energy and money go into keeping all those animals healthy and happy. everythingk is well documented and reported. these places can easily lose their contracts with one sick and neglected animal. One case of TB and every animal on the property needs to be destroyed.

I still agree that the feedlots are putting your average farmer out of business. My family used to run about 150 head in a cow.calf operation and also dabbled in grain/hay. when one industry was lagging, you usually had the other to rely on...back in the day. Luckily for us, we sold everything off before the first bse cow was discovered but I still watch my uncles struggling and trying to keep everything fed and healthy without losing the farm.

If you look through the news, and SPCA reports...it is not the feedlots that are making headlines. It is the average farmer that can no longer afford to care for their stock. I have seen alot of places, and while I still prefer to eat family raised beef, I have no qualms about buying from a super market.

Now..this is purely based on cattle...I have no personal experience with pigs or sheep.

I agree that transportation to the slaughter houses is a HUGE factor that needs to be changed. I hate driving by and seeing a livestock freighter loaded so toight that the steers cant even move. It is not the driver's fault...they are paid to drive.

Thats about my 2 cents for now, as I seem to be jumping all over and will need to think about this some more

I am really trying to stay out of this thread, being a farm girl, having worked at a feed lot, persuing a career in agriculture...but I just have to say, this post is absolutely correct.

Aztecnitemare · 01-13-2006, 02:33 PM

Don't really like these threads just because I've seen both sides of the coin.

Now for the hay shortage in Texas. Hay being expensive, yep it is. I paid three times what I normally pay for hay and it seems it isn't going to get better either. So if you can't afford hay for your horses then you find aslternative methods of feeding roughage, i.e. beet pulp, alfalfa cubes, alfalfa pellets, etc etc. Or feed a complete feed. Many do, and their horses are fine. Or have hay shipped in as I did.

Horses are not cows. We teach horses to trust us and do many many things that aren't natural. We don't commonly teach that to cows. Of course there are exception to the rule. Pig farms in Indiana don't treat their pigs like pets either. They aren't groomed, or petted, etc etc. ( I don't personally eat pork because pigs are so intellgent)Only those that see horses as a possesion rather than a companion say horses are livestock. Let's see if it was your dog, you'd have something different to say about slaughter.
Please don't give me that more neglected horses if slaughter end. Neglect is on the rise and not just because of the dought. There will and always will be fools who won't take proper care of their horses.
Now please tell me if you care so much for animals and how right it is for there to be slaughter, because what if there wasn't, all these horses will suffer, how can an animal thrown out of its normal situation, crammed into a trailer with many other horses, then going up a line where they can SMELL the death, isn't cruel?
Tell me how you can justify sending an animal to slaughter, when a $1.00 bullet would be better for them?

MyBabyTex · 01-13-2006, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aztecnitemare

Tell me how you can justify sending an animal to slaughter, when a $1.00 bullet would be better for them?

Interesting point. Many answers for that. I'll try to give one potential answer.

I think people don't want to be responsible for the horses death. If they phsyically pull the trigger, or arrange for the death, it is their doing. They feel guilty. If they send the horse to auction, fully knowing the horse will likely be bought by a meat buyer, it is not their fault. (not saying thats how I think but how some people might) So the guilt is off their shoulders.

I guess putting a horse to auction is at least a chance. When euthanasia or a bullet is finite.

Gallop N Gal · 01-13-2006, 02:45 PM

Yes all animals are gettin slaughtered!! I was doing a report for school and i did it on horse slaughter. here it is! sorry it kinda long!

Stop Horse Slaughter

In the plains of Texas, the last wild mustang herd neighs with terror as they watch their kind being slaughtered off. Their flesh is torn and they are half dead, but now some people wonder who the real beasts are, Mustang or
man. Trying to put an end to horse slaughter is more than a one person job.
Some people think that the horses being killed are sick and old. The truth is that most horses are killed because they are on wanted land. The only way for people to claim that land is by getting rid of the horses and their decision is slaughter. Mares that don’t produce good quality foals are also sent to the slaughter house. Race horses are also another victim, if they don’t win a lot their owners will kill them. Sometimes if a horse has been for sale for a long time the owner will send them away.
People for horse slaughter say “What if the horse is sick or old, then is it okay?” The truth is they won’t use sick, old horses. They want to use young horses for what ever product their making. If you knew the truth on how they kill these noble animals, you would agree with me. First they don’t give them food or water. Then to kill them they shoot a metal rod into their brain. If the horse is to wild then they hang them by their hind legs and slit their throats.
Think of all the things these animals have done for us. They pulled our ancestors carts, built their villages, plowed fields on terrain that a tractor would get stuck on, ran as fast as they could for the Pony Express. They put up with having a 200 pound person on their back.
What have we done to repay them, killed them, abused them, whipped them, and tortured them with slaughter.
Horses are the beauty of the west. They should be here for generations to come. No horse deserves the death penalty. All horses have a purpose in life, but we as people have to let them fulfill that destiny. All people need to realize the natural beauty of horses and put an end to the slaughter of these noble and intelligent animals.

thats it!! can u belive what they do!!

01-11-2006, 12:04 PM	#61
Sandra-A1 Senior Member+ Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Alabama Posts: 8,158 Images: 206	No problem here MyBabyTex....I understood your first post and had no problem understanding the point you were trying to make. I do agree that we need to not only enforce the regulations that we already have in place but also need to work toward improving the farming/ranching that produces the beef, pork, lamb & poultry that feeds the nation. Pennymercantile, if it is the Humane Society of the United States (HSUS) you are referring to in your post..... I think I would check out them out a bit more before I gave them my full support. They seem to be changing their direction and becoming more like PETA when it comes to their direction and goals. If you would like you can start your research here: http://www.animalscam.com/organizations.cfm __________________ "It is our choices Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities." ~Dumbledore

01-11-2006, 12:06 PM	#62
Shotgun93 Senior Moderator Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Southwest SD Posts: 13,006 Images: 122	Okay - truce. I agree with your message, animal rights should be better. I have seen a change in the way animals are treated pryor to slaughter in feed lots and where they are raised. But, I haven't seen a change in transportation. My message is that people shouldn't believe everything that they see. Yes, those pictures are real, but they are taken out of context. They take pictures when the animals are brought in off the trucks, after being in cramped spaces for up to 48 hours straight. Of course the look desheveled, they are tired, hungry and dehydrated, and depending on the time of year, extremely hyper or hypo thermic. They are crammed into holding pens while awaiting to be sorted into bigger pens where they can be fed and watered. That's when the pictures are taken, right after the bring them in. Or when they are in holding pens in the facilities that they come from, awaiting to be loaded, or vaccinated, or moved, weighed or any number of things. The point is, they are not treated like that 24/7. And a lot of these groups make the general public believe that is the way they are treated constantly. I never said that you personally said that, but many groups do. And, the thing that drives me nuts about PETA is how they take things like that video and tell every one that will listen that every plant is like that. If they copped up to the fact that it was just THAT plant, maybe people could do more in trying to stop that particular plant. Instead, they say it's every plant, confusing the truth. They came here to protest a rendering plant and played that video over and over, screaming about how awful slaughter is. The thing is, that plant in particular doesn't even slaughter animals. They just clean up the by-products from other plants and make bone meal for animal food companies. They labeled that plant as a horrible place that kills helpless animals, when they don't even touch an actual animal. If they had taken that time and money and spent on Halal, maybe something good could be done. So, back to my original point. Yes, things do need to change. They have changed so much in the past 10 years, but there is always room for improvement. To me, the biggest problem is transportation, and that's what needs to be fixed. And, knowing what context images like the ones plastered all over the net were really done in, can do much more for stopping the problems than pulling on people's heart strings and mis-educating them. __________________ In the quiet light of the stable, you hear a muffled snort, the stamp of a hoof, a friendly nicker. Gentle eyes inquire, "How was your day old friend?" and suddenly, all your troubles fade away. -Author Unknown

01-11-2006, 04:31 PM	#65
Circle C Senior Member+ Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 2,581 Images: 53	I agree that the slaughter house animals should be treated better. I honestly don't see a big deal with horses being slaughtered. No, I would NEVER send one to be slaughtered, but we eat cows, sheep, calves, lambs, rabbitts, squirrels, turkeys, chickens, blah blah blah. The list goes on and on. What is so defferent about a horse? We can ride them....we can ride cows too. They can think and be trained.....so can cows (I've seen cows that can do amazing things). Honestly, what is so different about a horse? Nothing IMO. A horse is an animal, a piece of livestock. Whether you decide to eat it or befriend it is your choice. No, I wouldn't eat a horse, but I can't say I'm against some one else eating one. My Points: It's sad, yes, that healthy, unwanted horses are being sent to the slaughter houses, but so are other animals. I'm not against or for slaughtering horses (or other animals). I eat meat. Slaughter house animals should be well taken care of, not abused like you see all too often. __________________ *Casey* *Weber Harris Ford-Lincoln-Mercury* *Meadville, PA* *(814) 336-3166*

01-13-2006, 02:45 PM	#70
Gallop N Gal Senior Member+ Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Land O' Cheese Posts: 3,585 Images: 647 Blog Entries: 2	Yes all animals are gettin slaughtered!! I was doing a report for school and i did it on horse slaughter. here it is! sorry it kinda long! Stop Horse Slaughter In the plains of Texas, the last wild mustang herd neighs with terror as they watch their kind being slaughtered off. Their flesh is torn and they are half dead, but now some people wonder who the real beasts are, Mustang or man. Trying to put an end to horse slaughter is more than a one person job. Some people think that the horses being killed are sick and old. The truth is that most horses are killed because they are on wanted land. The only way for people to claim that land is by getting rid of the horses and their decision is slaughter. Mares that don’t produce good quality foals are also sent to the slaughter house. Race horses are also another victim, if they don’t win a lot their owners will kill them. Sometimes if a horse has been for sale for a long time the owner will send them away. People for horse slaughter say “What if the horse is sick or old, then is it okay?” The truth is they won’t use sick, old horses. They want to use young horses for what ever product their making. If you knew the truth on how they kill these noble animals, you would agree with me. First they don’t give them food or water. Then to kill them they shoot a metal rod into their brain. If the horse is to wild then they hang them by their hind legs and slit their throats. Think of all the things these animals have done for us. They pulled our ancestors carts, built their villages, plowed fields on terrain that a tractor would get stuck on, ran as fast as they could for the Pony Express. They put up with having a 200 pound person on their back. What have we done to repay them, killed them, abused them, whipped them, and tortured them with slaughter. Horses are the beauty of the west. They should be here for generations to come. No horse deserves the death penalty. All horses have a purpose in life, but we as people have to let them fulfill that destiny. All people need to realize the natural beauty of horses and put an end to the slaughter of these noble and intelligent animals. thats it!! can u belive what they do!! __________________ *It Takes More Muscles to Frown* ......Than to Smile!**

01-13-2006, 02:33 PM	#68
Aztecnitemare Full Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 54 Images: 2	Don't really like these threads just because I've seen both sides of the coin. Now for the hay shortage in Texas. Hay being expensive, yep it is. I paid three times what I normally pay for hay and it seems it isn't going to get better either. So if you can't afford hay for your horses then you find aslternative methods of feeding roughage, i.e. beet pulp, alfalfa cubes, alfalfa pellets, etc etc. Or feed a complete feed. Many do, and their horses are fine. Or have hay shipped in as I did. Horses are not cows. We teach horses to trust us and do many many things that aren't natural. We don't commonly teach that to cows. Of course there are exception to the rule. Pig farms in Indiana don't treat their pigs like pets either. They aren't groomed, or petted, etc etc. ( I don't personally eat pork because pigs are so intellgent)Only those that see horses as a possesion rather than a companion say horses are livestock. Let's see if it was your dog, you'd have something different to say about slaughter. Please don't give me that more neglected horses if slaughter end. Neglect is on the rise and not just because of the dought. There will and always will be fools who won't take proper care of their horses. Now please tell me if you care so much for animals and how right it is for there to be slaughter, because what if there wasn't, all these horses will suffer, how can an animal thrown out of its normal situation, crammed into a trailer with many other horses, then going up a line where they can SMELL the death, isn't cruel? Tell me how you can justify sending an animal to slaughter, when a $1.00 bullet would be better for them?