Not Your Typical Ending Slaughter Thread

Blistering Winds · 01-10-2006, 11:36 PM

Also, those that are worried about the farmers cutting cost.

Next time you go to the store, don't complain about the price. the higher your consumer price is, the more the "farmer" gets. Which isn't much of that price to begin with.

I love people I'm chatting with in the store complaining about the treatment of animals, this and that, how the cattle need to roam and not sit in a pen, then complain that hamburger is sitting at 1.49 a lb for the cheap stuff, or complain that their meat is too tough or other things that tend to show up with/without feedlot intervention.

Right now, feed lot cattle is rising because of the LACK of grass available. Last year, the feed lots got hit by a LACK of cattle in their yards, as there was PLENTY of wheat grass to leave the cattle on.

This year, I see a higher dependance on feed lots as we had a BAD drought last year, and still haven't seen much moisture in this area, which is a HUGE finishing/slaughter area compared to majority of the US.

It all comes down to grass availability, not just land availability.

It is MUCH cheaper for the farmer to leave their cattle on grass till the last few weeks, then sell and let the slaughter house feed lot them for the final days.

Because when feed lotted, you get a higher mortality rate, medication use, TONS of concentrates fed out, etc. If the cattle have enough grass, the farmers reap the benefits by not having much cost at all. So it is better for BOTH the cow and the farmer for us to have a great grass season.

Unfortunately, that isn't currently happening. So I expect the feedlots to fill back up early this year, and the cost rise again.

Trick Chick · 01-11-2006, 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lou3

THIS SITE IS RUN BY ANIMAL RIGHTS ACTIVISTS AND NOTHING ON IT IS REMOTELY TRUE. Please dont take ANYTHING that PETA, hsus, or any other site lobbying for animals RIGHTS or lobbying pro-vegetarianism on welfare grounds seriously. The whole lot is a bunch of balony. If all organisations citing animal rights were shut down the organisations concerned with animal welfare would be a lot better off and be able to make a lot more difference to improving the lives of animals everywhere.

The thing is.............you should go watch the peta video from the start and see what the point of the thread was. Peta do go on and on and on about these things and people might decide to listen and accept these problems or be an activist against them. The cow in the vid was inhumanely destroyed, nobody can deny that. That is the point of the thread. not whether Peta is good or bad. Not whether Mustangs should be culled or not.

Trick Chick · 01-11-2006, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drafty1

The slaughter plant that the cattle were being slaughtered in the video was a Kosher plant. Kosher slaughter has to fallow the jewish law as to how the animal is killed.

It looks to me that the animal suffers more than if it were to be bolted. They have a book written ages ago and still fallow that law, this may have been the best way to kill animals back then, but come on get with the times.
I'm not sure how a worker could do that work day in and day out. The video makes me sad and sick.

The sad fact is that there is never going to be an end to animals being butchered because by being the smart people that we are we have created a way for us to live longer and to populate easier. There is no natural selection in people where the weak die and the strong go on. The balance is gone. We have made the choice that we go on and grow and nature will move over and everything will take second place to us.

Thank you! This is what i was wondering.

Lou3 · 01-11-2006, 02:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyBabyTex

I'm not sure what PETA article you are talking about? I never posted a PETA article.

Do you mean The video?? Well, I don't know how you can dispute that. There the cows are, throats slit, guts hanging out, and still walking around and mooing. I understand how animals twitch after death but walking and mooing is not an afterdeath twitch. These animals were alive. So no, sorry I don't quite get how that could be 95% false. You can't argue with what you can see.

The video was a kosher plant - a tiny minority and also something which most people (myself included) agree SHOULD be shut down. This does NOT occur in normal slaughter which is more than 95% of total slaughter. PETA has once again taken something out of context and portrayed it as "normal" for the industry. THIS IS WHAT THEY DO. It is how they try to rally support for their ridiculous cause, lies, exaggeration and misinterpretation. I have seen PETA take a photo of sheep gathered for shearing in a yard and say that it was representative of how the flock lived all the time. Absolute rubbish.
The article I was referring to was the newspaper article you posted with the interview from the ex-worker which contained information that was fundamentally flawed in many ways, a classic example of how wrong articles by lay-people most often are.

Blistering Winds · 01-11-2006, 05:35 AM

To take one PETA video and call it "THIS HAPPENS AT ALL SLAUGHTER PLANTS" is wrong.

PETA leaves out key facts. Like Kosher plants. They leave that fact out, which Kosher plants are few and far between. And when you dive into the medical aspect of Kosher, it seems grusom, but the animal is unconcious in seconds. Their blood pressure DROPS fast, causing them to black out fast. I've seen a few kosher kills now, they did a few up at the Texas Diagnostic clinic not long ago. HUGE deal here, but many vets attended to learn a bit more about the process.

LEARNING about the process will help your "cause", one way or the other.

PETA tends to take one incident, usually an ISOLATED incident, and say THIS is what happens all the time. Which is wrong.

PETA also has video of MEXICAN slaughter houses or a 20+ yr old video of Beltex and say that it is still going on here in the US, when the plant doesn't even LOOK Like that anymore.

Until you've BEEN on the slaughter house facilities, and been at the knocker, and seen the process, personally you do not have much to say ABOUT The process based upon videos.

I can video tape or take a pic of John Lyons, Clinton Anderson, etc at a particular step, and say OMG, they are ABUSING them and people will run rampid, saying they are abusers, etc. But when you watch the WHOLE manuver, the horse wasn't harmed physically or mentally. Just one bad picture.

Animal "RIGHTS" people play on emotion, NOT facts. Animal Welfare people, however, do work on facts more than emotion.

Shotgun93 · 01-11-2006, 07:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MyBabyTex

Just wanted to say: To everyone who gave me personal thanks for starting this thread, you are very welcome. I feel that this needed to be said. If even half of the people agree with what I have said and have compassion for these animals, that is all that matters. And it looks like more than half of you do. Something may just be done one day. People do care.

Cheers.

This is a totally unfair thing to say. DO NOT ever say that I don't have compassion for animals just because I don't buy into a misrepresented video put out by a very questionable organization. I have more comapassion than most people have in their little finger and helped more abused and neglected animals than I can even count.
I personally wrote to my congressman and met with the govenor of my state to discuss better transportation for animals going to feed lots and slaughter. I have taken an active role in bettering the lives of these animals. People are always going to eat animals, that's the way it is. I have been to packing plants and I have seen how they work the animals. What I saw was not inhumane or evil. It was workers doing a good job providing food for a country, providing materials for clothes, cars and pet food. The animals die quickly and cleanly. I have been to feed lots, chicken farms and hog systems, I never saw an abused or neglected animal.

You may have you opinion and I may have mine, but do not ever accuse me of being not compassionate or caring for animals. I honestly thought that you knew me better than that.

Equine_Harmony · 01-11-2006, 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kiwi Pony

So what? To be blunt, the world does not revolve around America, nor does (or should) everyone else set their standards and culture by the USA's.

Good greif. What about the bullocks that pulled the carts of American settlers over hundreds of miles, for months and months. Often to be eaten at the end. I guess the horse gets singled out because it is the only animal with a large cross-over between work/food animal and pleasure animal/pet. Do you know many, many times more horses are considered work, labour animals, and food animals, than the number that are used for leisure or sport. Why do you try to restrict their status to 'pet' only? I'm rather unimpressed with the romantic rhetoric (not just refering to this lot) about the history of the horse. They did not singlehandedly do anything. Many other animals, and most of all people!! helped made history possible. Many other animals 'serve us "nobely"'.

Personally, with the amount of horses the racing industry produces, I think culling (via slaughter) is an essential method of dealing with the riff raff that sometimes results. Yup, there are horses who just aren't up to racing. And that's ok. They can fulfill another need instead.

As you may have guessed by now, nope, not one bit

After all this typing I think I can sum up my POV very quickly:
Anti horse slaughter people see horses as pets/leisure animals only.
I see horses as pets, OR work animals, OR food animals.

I have read the other side menaing pro slaughter, I am learning from them in a nice way why they are pro slaughter, this helps me, educates me. I just got my feet wet not to long ago about horse slaughter and I am honest, and not rude like you. If you want to get your point across to me or anyone in the future yes, bring on the facts you hold but give respect as well for people will really hear or read into what you have to say. and BTW: this is not a thread about horse slaughter. I was told by the poster and respect this poster.

MyBabyTex · 01-11-2006, 11:13 AM

Alright everyone, calm down. Take the gloves off.

I think Trick Chick got my point exactly. Thank you very much for your post.

{To take one PETA video and call it "THIS HAPPENS AT ALL SLAUGHTER PLANTS" is wrong.}

I don't think anyone said this? I know I certainly did not.

This video was taken at a KOSHER facility. It says so on the video!!! I don't trust the videos PETA has taken before because they are decades old (Which I have said a FEW times in here) and this one is from 2004 and shows in detail the atrocities still occuring. Doesn't matter if it is in a Kosher facility or a Halal facility, bad **** is going down and we are all relatively powerless to stop it. But we can try.

I think a lot of you are NOT getting the point of the thread. So if there is any confusion, please refer back to my original post and not the hijinx that seems to have occured after it. I think some of you are not understanding or misinterpreting my message.

Let's just FORGET about all the videos okay? I am going to take them out of the posts, as well as the site links as well. Because you all blew it way out of proportion. I was not saying these sites are correct in any way. I was saying the pictures are correct. The video is correct. I don't care what their messages are besides that. MY message is what I posted. I was trying to show some images to stir emotion. Not to blast me for supporting PETA. For all who know me, you know I whole heartedly do not support PETA in any way shape or form.

Anyways... I would realy appreciate the thread being brought back on topic. (I don't want any hurt feelings here.)Which was the focus that slaughter is not wrong, but necessary, but the inhumane way the animals are treated prior to slaughter is. Not saying every g d farm is inhumane. NOT EVEN close to my point!! I hate how everything can be taken apart and make me seem like a crazy animal rights supporter when i am in fact just a concerned consumer, concerned for animal WELFARE. I am trying to help people who are supporters of some of these organizations see that there are other things that should be addressed and donated to besides these sites. That these sites are faulty in that slaughter can never end, but inhumane practises can. I know I already got through to one person, and that made me feel really good.

I would just really like to see this thread not go the way of other slaughter threads. My message is quite different. I just really don't want another 6 pages of this. Everyone has stated how they feel, and that is great. I just don't want any fights starting.

And no Shotgun, I didn't mean you weren't compassionate. Not at all!! If anything, the total opposite. I was just describing the people who had thanked me. A lot of them used the word compassion, and I guess it just came out. Didn't mean to make you feel like I was attacking you in any way. It was pretty late at night when I wrote that as well. And if you know me, you know I am not a PETA or crazy left wing animal rights sponsorer. I am just trying to get across a message that I honestly believe you agree with. That all animals deserve humane habitat to live in prior to slaughter and all animals deserve uncrowded, safe transportaton to slaughter. And it looks like you did something for the latter. Good for you! More people should talk to their Governors and mayors and make a fuss. That is the only way to get your voice heard.

REMOVING THE VIDEOS AND SITE LINKS NOW. PLEASE DO NOT DISCUSS THEM ANYMORE AS THEY ARE IRRELEVANT TO THE TOPIC AT HAND.

Pennymercantile · 01-11-2006, 11:13 AM

I was brought to tears of the cattle video...I don't care if it was Kosher or not. I am very anti slaughter and I have a friend who is not against it.

I don't think the videos are anything but the truth it is on tape...I do wish to see what one considers a modern slaughterhouse esp. for horses to look like.

I am against the horse slaughter. If it is not bad here what else is it like in other countries. Why isn't there some regulation on the horse industry or on greyhound racing another bad industry in my opinon. My brother worked for a greyhound farm and they used to kill the nicer ones that tried to stop the fights because they only wanted the agressive dog. He came out of there with a very definite opinion on greyhound racing and it wasn't nice.

Gayle

Pennymercantile · 01-11-2006, 11:17 AM

PS.... I also think the PETA is way out there I am more inclined to appreciate the Human Society.

I SAY KEEP THE VIDEOS AND LET THEM SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES.

I FOR ONE APPRECIATE THEM BEING POSTED>

Gayle

01-10-2006, 11:36 PM	#51
Blistering Winds Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Augusta, Kansas Posts: 31,416 Images: 793 Blog Entries: 16	Also, those that are worried about the farmers cutting cost. Next time you go to the store, don't complain about the price. the higher your consumer price is, the more the "farmer" gets. Which isn't much of that price to begin with. I love people I'm chatting with in the store complaining about the treatment of animals, this and that, how the cattle need to roam and not sit in a pen, then complain that hamburger is sitting at 1.49 a lb for the cheap stuff, or complain that their meat is too tough or other things that tend to show up with/without feedlot intervention. Right now, feed lot cattle is rising because of the LACK of grass available. Last year, the feed lots got hit by a LACK of cattle in their yards, as there was PLENTY of wheat grass to leave the cattle on. This year, I see a higher dependance on feed lots as we had a BAD drought last year, and still haven't seen much moisture in this area, which is a HUGE finishing/slaughter area compared to majority of the US. It all comes down to grass availability, not just land availability. It is MUCH cheaper for the farmer to leave their cattle on grass till the last few weeks, then sell and let the slaughter house feed lot them for the final days. Because when feed lotted, you get a higher mortality rate, medication use, TONS of concentrates fed out, etc. If the cattle have enough grass, the farmers reap the benefits by not having much cost at all. So it is better for BOTH the cow and the farmer for us to have a great grass season. Unfortunately, that isn't currently happening. So I expect the feedlots to fill back up early this year, and the cost rise again. __________________ 20 lb club: New year Start: 175 Goal: 130 Current: 158 Total loss this year 17 lbs.

01-11-2006, 05:35 AM	#55
Blistering Winds Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Augusta, Kansas Posts: 31,416 Images: 793 Blog Entries: 16	To take one PETA video and call it "THIS HAPPENS AT ALL SLAUGHTER PLANTS" is wrong. PETA leaves out key facts. Like Kosher plants. They leave that fact out, which Kosher plants are few and far between. And when you dive into the medical aspect of Kosher, it seems grusom, but the animal is unconcious in seconds. Their blood pressure DROPS fast, causing them to black out fast. I've seen a few kosher kills now, they did a few up at the Texas Diagnostic clinic not long ago. HUGE deal here, but many vets attended to learn a bit more about the process. LEARNING about the process will help your "cause", one way or the other. PETA tends to take one incident, usually an ISOLATED incident, and say THIS is what happens all the time. Which is wrong. PETA also has video of MEXICAN slaughter houses or a 20+ yr old video of Beltex and say that it is still going on here in the US, when the plant doesn't even LOOK Like that anymore. Until you've BEEN on the slaughter house facilities, and been at the knocker, and seen the process, personally you do not have much to say ABOUT The process based upon videos. I can video tape or take a pic of John Lyons, Clinton Anderson, etc at a particular step, and say OMG, they are ABUSING them and people will run rampid, saying they are abusers, etc. But when you watch the WHOLE manuver, the horse wasn't harmed physically or mentally. Just one bad picture. Animal "RIGHTS" people play on emotion, NOT facts. Animal Welfare people, however, do work on facts more than emotion. __________________ 20 lb club: New year Start: 175 Goal: 130 Current: 158 Total loss this year 17 lbs.

01-11-2006, 11:13 AM	#58
MyBabyTex Senior Member+ Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 3,163 Images: 65	Alright everyone, calm down. Take the gloves off. I think Trick Chick got my point exactly. Thank you very much for your post. {To take one PETA video and call it "THIS HAPPENS AT ALL SLAUGHTER PLANTS" is wrong.} I don't think anyone said this? I know I certainly did not. This video was taken at a KOSHER facility. It says so on the video!!! I don't trust the videos PETA has taken before because they are decades old (Which I have said a FEW times in here) and this one is from 2004 and shows in detail the atrocities still occuring. Doesn't matter if it is in a Kosher facility or a Halal facility, bad ** is going down and we are all relatively powerless to stop it. But we can try. I think a lot of you are NOT getting the point of the thread. So if there is any confusion, please refer back to my original post and not the hijinx that seems to have occured after it. I think some of you are not understanding or misinterpreting my message. Let's just FORGET about all the videos okay? I am going to take them out of the posts, as well as the site links as well. Because you all blew it way out of proportion. I was not saying these sites are correct in any way. I was saying the pictures are correct. The video is correct. I don't care what their messages are besides that. MY message is what I posted. I was trying to show some images to stir emotion. Not to blast me for supporting PETA. For all who know me, you know I whole heartedly do not support PETA in any way shape or form. Anyways... I would realy appreciate the thread being brought back on topic. (I don't want any hurt feelings here.)Which was the focus that slaughter is not wrong, but necessary, but the inhumane way the animals are treated prior to slaughter is. Not saying every g d farm is inhumane. NOT EVEN close to my point!! I hate how everything can be taken apart and make me seem like a crazy animal rights supporter when i am in fact just a concerned consumer, concerned for animal WELFARE. I am trying to help people who are supporters of some of these organizations see that there are other things that should be addressed and donated to besides these sites. That these sites are faulty in that slaughter can never end, but inhumane practises can. I know I already got through to one person, and that made me feel really good. I would just really like to see this thread not go the way of other slaughter threads. My message is quite different. I just really don't want another 6 pages of this. Everyone has stated how they feel, and that is great. I just don't want any fights starting. And no Shotgun, I didn't mean you weren't compassionate. Not at all!! If anything, the total opposite. I was just describing the people who had thanked me. A lot of them used the word compassion, and I guess it just came out. Didn't mean to make you feel like I was attacking you in any way. It was pretty late at night when I wrote that as well. And if you know me, you know I am not a PETA or crazy left wing animal rights sponsorer. I am just trying to get across a message that I honestly believe you agree with. That all animals deserve humane habitat to live in prior to slaughter and all animals deserve uncrowded, safe transportaton to slaughter. And it looks like you did something for the latter. Good for you! More people should talk to their Governors and mayors and make a fuss. That is the only way to get your voice heard. REMOVING THE VIDEOS AND SITE LINKS NOW. PLEASE DO NOT DISCUSS THEM ANYMORE AS THEY ARE IRRELEVANT TO THE TOPIC AT HAND.**

01-11-2006, 11:13 AM	#59
Pennymercantile Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: South Carolina Posts: 1,061 Images: 74	I was brought to tears of the cattle video...I don't care if it was Kosher or not. I am very anti slaughter and I have a friend who is not against it. I don't think the videos are anything but the truth it is on tape...I do wish to see what one considers a modern slaughterhouse esp. for horses to look like. I am against the horse slaughter. If it is not bad here what else is it like in other countries. Why isn't there some regulation on the horse industry or on greyhound racing another bad industry in my opinon. My brother worked for a greyhound farm and they used to kill the nicer ones that tried to stop the fights because they only wanted the agressive dog. He came out of there with a very definite opinion on greyhound racing and it wasn't nice. Gayle

01-11-2006, 11:17 AM	#60
Pennymercantile Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: South Carolina Posts: 1,061 Images: 74	PS.... I also think the PETA is way out there I am more inclined to appreciate the Human Society. I SAY KEEP THE VIDEOS AND LET THEM SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES. I FOR ONE APPRECIATE THEM BEING POSTED> Gayle