[MissHoneys]

Originally Posted by hamerface

Thats strange because those mares are in Canada...
hmmm....

thats what i thought too.. it says about transport to places in the states but nothing about canada :S

[hamerface]

Originally Posted by MissHoneys

thats what i thought too.. it says about transport to places in the states but nothing about canada :S

Depending where you are, I know for certain you can pick up a draft cross, or even registered mare for under $500 and you would still be rescuing someone

[Broken A Ranch]

That is probably because Canada doesn't want to deal with the PMU problem so they ship most of them off to the states or threaten feedlots and KBers to make us more sympathetic to the issue.

While I see nothing wrong with adopting a PMU horse, I think Canada needs to deal with the overflow of horses caused by the production and practices involved in a way other than adding to the overflow of horses in the states. They play the game because of the money involved, but nobody wants to deal with the "casulties" so to speak.

Just my opinion

[hamerface]

Originally Posted by Broken A Ranch

That is probably because Canada doesn't want to deal with the PMU problem so they ship most of them off to the states or threaten feedlots and KBers to make us more sympathetic to the issue.

While I see nothing wrong with adopting a PMU horse, I think Canada needs to deal with the overflow of horses caused by the production and practices involved in a way other than adding to the overflow of horses in the states. They play the game because of the money involved, but nobody wants to deal with the "casulties" so to speak.

Just my opinion

......... and Americans and the rest of the world use PMU products.... I guess we're just the ones getting our hands dirty up here...
Honestly, to say that Canadians don't take responsibility for the PMU problem is a bit problematic for me.

The industry exists for the need or desire for hormone replacement therapy, when people stop wanting/needing these drugs PMU facilities will be virtually obsolete, if not entirely.
Yes there are synthetic alternatives, this I believe is a large reason why Wyeth cut their farms in half [Quote}From 409 PMU facilities in early 2003, only 130 will still continue operating for Wyeth – 80 in Manitoba, 20 in Saskatchewan, 20 in Alberta, and 10 in the United States. [End Quote]
Wyeth is an American company, relying on Canadian industries... Do I agree with Premarin? No, but give youre head a shake, Canadians are not why it exists, or why these farms exist.
I have a plethora of tables and documents from the Agricultural boards of Alberta, Saskatchewan and Manitoba,

Each of these provinces is reporting a significant DECLINE in PMU production, which is largely why these mares, and foals are up for adoption. If one closes a PMU facility the mares have to go somewhere... no?

I will dig up the charts tomorrow, right now I am on a borrowed PC and it doesnt like the format or reformatting the charts I have.

Here is a snippet
TABLE 137: Historical Production Value Summary of Other Farm Products
Pregnant Mares Urine
2003 ................ 61,294
2004 ................ 59,849
VS….
2005 ................ 19,305
2006 ................ 12,059

* Season ending in year specified.
SOURCE: Wyeth Organics; Manitoba Agriculture, Food and Rural Initiatives, Statistics Canada, Census of Agriculture.
Table 67: Pregnant Mare Urine (PMU) Statistics, Alberta, 1990-91 to 2007-08

YEAR Number Farms Gross
of mares revenue

2004-05................................................ ...... 1,478 19 3 ,946

2005-06........................................... 0 0 0
2006-07........................................... 0 0 0
2007-08p......................................... 0 0 0
Source: Alberta Agriculture and Rural Development


To say that we are not taking control of the PMU problem? Really no one is forcing anyone to rescue these horses...
Take this statistic for example

* In 2007, 79 415 horses were slaughtered in Canada
* In 2007, horse slaughter ended in the United States. But the American Horse Slaughter Prevention Act has not yet been enacted (banning transport for slaughter.) As a result, there was a 49% increase in horse imports for slaughter to Canada from the US in 2007.

which means 38913 additional horses crossed our border to our plants...
The PMU industry as it stands now, does not produce anywhere near that amount of foals...
Those are 38913 horses, Americans are not dealing with properly. IMHO there are 38913 horses in the US that need rescuing before anyone starts pointing fingers across the border.

[Broken A Ranch]

Partially exactly my point. Americans need to deal with their OWN overflow of unwanted rescue horses instead of hauling more of them over from Canada. I don't agree with premarin and believe that the synthetic is a more than viable alternative. Frankly if they stopped producing premarin, and only offered the alternative(s) they could take care of a nice chunk of the horse overpopulation caused by the production of premarin.

Canada is responsible for the overflow of these horses because they are produced in Canada. Period. If a **** I dunno Spanish company set up farm in the US (for example) and started producing large quantities of unwanted lets say monkeys, I would believe that the US is responsible for regulating that company and saying THIS is how you need to handle the overflow so it doesn't impact everything else.

If one closes a PMU plant and there is no room for the mares at another plant after of course careful culling and replacing of mares that have already been bred to death, I believe that humane euthanasia in the industries current climate is a viable alternative. If you closed a cattle feedlot and the cows had no place to go I really don't think that you would say ok.. please PROMISE not to breed this cute old over bred lightly handled cow and you can have her for a minimal price. In this instance PMU horses are very much "livestock" who have served a purpose. Frankly they are probably replacing those that are "adopted" out with younger versions who have more breeding years on them anyway, and while I do appreciate the efforts to better the bloodlines of PMU horses so they are more adoptable; you can't ride bloodlines or pedigrees and I would think that the better bloodlined horses would moreso appeal to someone who wants to BREED them, whether a start up or a backyard breeder. That kinda defeats the purpose all together doesn't it?

Don't mind me... I also think that they should reopen slaughter plants in the US with stronger regulations and that horse meat should be available for sale in the states. This would immediately stop the problems that they are having in states such as Florida where people are finding their pets slaughtered for meat that is a normal food source in other countries and take care of some of the over population issues as well.

[tsunami76020]

why are the horses and foals going to be sent to a feedlot? and what is a feedlot?
I may be new but there are a lot of things i am not familiar with. What is a KBer? ANybody have answers?

[tsunami76020]

Sorry to sound so dumb but what are PMU horses?

[punkerchick111]

Originally Posted by tsunami76020

Sorry to sound so dumb but what are PMU horses?

PMU= Pregnant Mare's Urine

Premarin® stands for Pregnant Mares' Urine (PREgnant MARes' urINe); PMU for short (we spell it both ways, with an "e", PREgnant MARes' urINE which is the older name used in Canada, and without -- which is the more popular recent spelling, and the one that is a U.S. registered trademark).
Premarin (including Prempro, Premphase, Prempac, and Premelle) is a drug made up of conjugated estrogens obtained from the urine of pregnant mares -- put out in many forms (pills, creams, injections, patches, vaginal rings) and is used to reduce the symptoms of menopause in women or women who have had a hysterectomy. It is also prescribed to nearly eliminate the risk of osteoporosis (the brittling of bones) and reduce the chance of heart disease in women over 50.
As of November 2003, approximately nine million American women are still taking some form of Premarin (1 million women in the United States were still taking Prempro pills as of June 2003, down from the 3.4 million taking the drug before the negative Women's Health Initiative study results became known). This is a reduction of 25% from the high figure of approximately 12 million women taking PMU based medications in 1999.
About a third of the approximately fifty-five million post menopausal women in the United States are on estrogen replacement therapy (ERT), or hormone replacement therapy (HRT), and of them, about 49% currently use PMU based products (down from a high of 79% in 1999) -- while there are a number of estrogens excreted by the pregnant mare, estrone sulfate, equilin, and equilenin are the most significant.
It is the only human estrogen replacement drug that is derived from an animal (hormones beginning with the letter "e" are specific to equines, hormones beginning with the letter "h" are specific to humans).

[Stormyheart6160]

Originally Posted by Broken A Ranch

That is probably because Canada doesn't want to deal with the PMU problem so they ship most of them off to the states or threaten feedlots and KBers to make us more sympathetic to the issue.

While I see nothing wrong with adopting a PMU horse, I think Canada needs to deal with the overflow of horses caused by the production and practices involved in a way other than adding to the overflow of horses in the states. They play the game because of the money involved, but nobody wants to deal with the "casulties" so to speak.

Just my opinion

We can make a deal with them.....they quit sending their PMU's to us here in the states, and we'll stop sending our horses to them to slaughter.

[Stormyheart6160]

Originally Posted by tsunami76020

why are the horses and foals going to be sent to a feedlot? and what is a feedlot?
I may be new but there are a lot of things i am not familiar with. What is a KBer? ANybody have answers?

Horses are being sent to feedlots, which is where they get fattened up for slaughter.

KBer= Kill buyer......the people who purchase these horses to have them butchered and their meat sent overseas for the rich folks to eat.