line breeding?

Blistering Winds · 11-24-2004, 06:49 AM

Helen, actually, most foals do NOT show up messed up. I know a whole line of Reiners that are double bred consistantly and line bred HEAVILY. The foals are all AWESOME!!!

Line breeding has worked for them. They have been very well educated and watch for genetic problems.

If you do it right and know what you are doing, it can be great. If you just breed some piece of something to another piece of something and expect greatness, you are sorely wrong!

Line breeding can also be utilized to breed OUT undesirable traits. If you know they are recessive, and you want to get rid of, say Ewe-necks. If your line has ewe-necks show up yet the horses muscling, performances, etc you want to keep, you would line breed to one you know is homozygous, and then breed to the mare with the muscling and such you want. Hopefully you get something that is homozygous. Once you have several homozygous horses, the recessive gene you didn't want in your breeding program and horses.

Lou3 · 11-25-2004, 02:39 AM

Line breeding is fine if used for the proper reasons and not done too heavily. IMO anyone breeding closer than 1/4 shared genetics (thats first cousins grandsire-granddaughter etc) is asking for trouble but to breed for a certain type in your stock you have to do a little line breeding or you will get very sketchy, inconsistant results.
Lou

coonhunter69 · 11-26-2004, 04:28 PM

Line breeding has been used in cattle and others for many years and if done right ,works well . My coonhounds are all related, we line breed them 90% of the time. I can pretty well predict what type of traits thses pups will carry (type of mouth ,color,indepence,temperment ect..).When you line breed for a certain trait and if done right you can lock that in for the next several generations ect... When I outcross I'am looking for a sire that carries a certain trait that I want then I check out his pedegree and his offsprings. You really have to do your homework to get the results your looking for. I thank outcrossing is more of a gamble then a good line breeding program.

Bodi · 11-28-2004, 02:28 PM

I hate to tell you guys but you are going to find linebreeding and inbreeding in many varieties of horses especially those with limited gene pool's. Depending on the horse I support both but to a degree. I would much wrather choose a individual who is linebred (i.e. to one horse, in most cases a stallion as they are able to produce more, who is of exceptional quality or of the style I like), than to a individual who is linebred both in sireline and damline.

Barb - I can see why your mare would cross well on a non Skipper horse. Outcrossing. It's a wonderful thing.

As for the slightly ignorant comment about being lucky if you get anything halfway decent by linebreeding. I resent that as I have a father on daughter cross who is superb and exactly what one would expect. Being double to his sire, he is a replica to his sire. 75% of his sire's genes, doesn't take a rocket scientist for that one. But then his sire IMHO is considered a impressive individual who has minimal faults.

There are programs out there who are based on a singular horse or in some cases two and successfully breed individuals bringing quite fancy price tags in their market. They are nothing to sniff or hold your nose up at either.

If you know the horse you are linebreeding to and have any sort of decent common sense to see not only the good points in that horse but the faults as well then linebreeding is not a issue. Knowledge is power, and 'reading up' as much as you can is awesome. Understand the reasoning behind the pedigree's of the animals you use as example before instantly eviling out the fact that a horse or two may show up in their pedigree more than once. Fad's change in horses like day and night, year to year, even month to month. The horse or horses your animal may be linebred/inbred to may have been the shiznit in it's day and age and all the rave. It was the bodystyle/bloodlines/top dollar stallion or mare desired in it's day. Things to consider.

Diane B

coonhunter69 · 12-02-2004, 05:08 PM

When your thinking about breeding to that top stallion you need to do the homework, find out if he is a dominate sire, not a hybrid. If he is a dominate sire then he will pass on his traits that you wish to have to the mare. if he is a hybrid then your mare needs to be a dominate mare or at least a hybrid mare. The dominate sire is pretty hard to find. I belive breeding is science and that we are years behind in it. I believe the breeding for traits has more to do with what you want to accomplish, in your breeding program then anything else. I think most people have better luck with line breeding then the outcrossing but thats just my opinion.

11-24-2004, 06:49 AM	#21
Blistering Winds Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Augusta, Kansas Posts: 31,724 Images: 814 Blog Entries: 16	Helen, actually, most foals do NOT show up messed up. I know a whole line of Reiners that are double bred consistantly and line bred HEAVILY. The foals are all AWESOME!!! Line breeding has worked for them. They have been very well educated and watch for genetic problems. If you do it right and know what you are doing, it can be great. If you just breed some piece of something to another piece of something and expect greatness, you are sorely wrong! Line breeding can also be utilized to breed OUT undesirable traits. If you know they are recessive, and you want to get rid of, say Ewe-necks. If your line has ewe-necks show up yet the horses muscling, performances, etc you want to keep, you would line breed to one you know is homozygous, and then breed to the mare with the muscling and such you want. Hopefully you get something that is homozygous. Once you have several homozygous horses, the recessive gene you didn't want in your breeding program and horses. __________________ 20 lb club: New year Start: 175 Goal: 130 Current: 158 Total loss this year 17 lbs.

11-25-2004, 02:39 AM	#22
Lou3 Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: england Posts: 7,273 Images: 30 Blog Entries: 1	Line breeding is fine if used for the proper reasons and not done too heavily. IMO anyone breeding closer than 1/4 shared genetics (thats first cousins grandsire-granddaughter etc) is asking for trouble but to breed for a certain type in your stock you have to do a little line breeding or you will get very sketchy, inconsistant results. Lou __________________ Save the Earth . . . it's the only planet with chocolate FFFL

11-26-2004, 04:28 PM	#23
coonhunter69 Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ohio Posts: 7	Line breeding has been used in cattle and others for many years and if done right ,works well . My coonhounds are all related, we line breed them 90% of the time. I can pretty well predict what type of traits thses pups will carry (type of mouth ,color,indepence,temperment ect..).When you line breed for a certain trait and if done right you can lock that in for the next several generations ect... When I outcross I'am looking for a sire that carries a certain trait that I want then I check out his pedegree and his offsprings. You really have to do your homework to get the results your looking for. I thank outcrossing is more of a gamble then a good line breeding program. Last edited by coonhunter69; 12-02-2004 at 04:44 PM.

11-28-2004, 02:28 PM	#24
Bodi Senior Member+ Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Michigan Posts: 538 Images: 106	I hate to tell you guys but you are going to find linebreeding and inbreeding in many varieties of horses especially those with limited gene pool's. Depending on the horse I support both but to a degree. I would much wrather choose a individual who is linebred (i.e. to one horse, in most cases a stallion as they are able to produce more, who is of exceptional quality or of the style I like), than to a individual who is linebred both in sireline and damline. Barb - I can see why your mare would cross well on a non Skipper horse. Outcrossing. It's a wonderful thing. As for the slightly ignorant comment about being lucky if you get anything halfway decent by linebreeding. I resent that as I have a father on daughter cross who is superb and exactly what one would expect. Being double to his sire, he is a replica to his sire. 75% of his sire's genes, doesn't take a rocket scientist for that one. But then his sire IMHO is considered a impressive individual who has minimal faults. There are programs out there who are based on a singular horse or in some cases two and successfully breed individuals bringing quite fancy price tags in their market. They are nothing to sniff or hold your nose up at either. If you know the horse you are linebreeding to and have any sort of decent common sense to see not only the good points in that horse but the faults as well then linebreeding is not a issue. Knowledge is power, and 'reading up' as much as you can is awesome. Understand the reasoning behind the pedigree's of the animals you use as example before instantly eviling out the fact that a horse or two may show up in their pedigree more than once. Fad's change in horses like day and night, year to year, even month to month. The horse or horses your animal may be linebred/inbred to may have been the shiznit in it's day and age and all the rave. It was the bodystyle/bloodlines/top dollar stallion or mare desired in it's day. Things to consider. Diane B __________________ Diane Blanzy - Pipe Dream Percherons Home of the Blue Roan Percheron research project

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12-02-2004, 05:08 PM	#25
coonhunter69 Junior Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Ohio Posts: 7	When your thinking about breeding to that top stallion you need to do the homework, find out if he is a dominate sire, not a hybrid. If he is a dominate sire then he will pass on his traits that you wish to have to the mare. if he is a hybrid then your mare needs to be a dominate mare or at least a hybrid mare. The dominate sire is pretty hard to find. I belive breeding is science and that we are years behind in it. I believe the breeding for traits has more to do with what you want to accomplish, in your breeding program then anything else. I think most people have better luck with line breeding then the outcrossing but thats just my opinion.