[meljean]

Cheap beer, warm or chilled, whatever she will drink, to let her chill out, or try Aceing her a little in feed before you set off. Not after she gets wound up, as then it will do no good.

Just get her relaxed, and you might try radio too, if have place to put one, to break up sounds. Also, put Vicks Vaporub in nostrils, so scent will be altered.

[jackandlylah]

What an awful situation for you to be in!
Good luck with whatever you do.
(:

[StarfireArizona]

This is just my two cents, but if I had a horse that got so upset when I took a herdmate out that she was soaked and dripping with sweat when I got home, and was so exhausted that she laid down and wouldn't even get up to eat, I'd sell her YESTERDAY. If you aren't totally and completely attached to her for life, find her another home. I truly believe its the kindest thing you could do for her. Sounds as if this is a pattern, and its become automatic for her. She is getting herself so worked up that it may be only a matter of time before she colics very badly. My older Arab whinnies and paces the whole time I'm gone with one of his herdmates, but I don't come home to a dripping with sweat, exhausted horse. He's just a bit wound up. There's a big difference between my situation and yours. You have to look at what is best for your horse. I would think it might be best to have her live in a one-horse situation. Otherwise, I fear the same thing might happen all over again. Again, maybe not, because her son wouldn't be involved. In any case, I strongly feel she needs to be off your property and separated permanently from your other horses. Otherwise, your other horses may be ruined, from the sounds of how they act when she screams for them. These are just my feelings, of course.

I understand what you are saying.... But growing up in a household where my parents always "got rid" of any dog that presented a challenge, I vowed to find an alternative answer to those animal issues instead of giving up. I worked through much more serious problems with my now 8 year old, despite so many warnings from many different people to get rid of him, and I am so very happy I stuck with it. He is a totally different horse now....but it took ME learning how to deal with it & change his attitude. I could have passed him around as this mare has been, but it would have only made him worse for the next person. I know this is not the reason she was sold over and over again, for her foals were always sold before she was rehomed. She was just one of those horses no one really got attached to & was easy to dispose of. I have brought her through a lot of trust issues, and have a strong attachment & bond with her. She is sweet & sincerely worth the effort.

If after trying the suggestions here, & others suggested elsewhere, she is not responding, then I know I can't help her & her health is at risk. But if I can just find the right combination of treatments, I can get her through it. I really can't be the first to experience this, and as long as horses exist, I doubt I will be the last

There really is not much you can do about the calling and just have to work through it.
Everyone has different settings and I have a place that I can get away from the herd and also a place that they can kind of see each other.
The idea is to let the horse know that there is a beginning a middle and an end to the exercise.
In other words that the horse has a sense that the training will end at some point and they will be able to get back to their friends.

If the mare can not go for a long walk by her self then take one of the friends at first.
After a while you can change friends and then maybe try going all by herself.
You are really trying to get the mares attention on YOU!

After I wean my babies I take a long walk to the mail box about 1/4 mile down the road.
Sometimes I grab two babies and take a further walk to the end of the road which is a mile long.
This prepares them later in life as we start to take trail rides away from the herd.
You should be the center of that mares world,not the baby.

I will try walking her with my mother walking Rusty the old boy. He is really the only one my mother is able to handle....and he is as steadfast as you could ask for. Nothing rattles him except tractors. Shiloh hates Rusty, but a horse is a horse is a horse....and he is part of her herd. If he is quiet, she may be too

The baby is not her only concern....she gets nervous when ANY of them are leaving. Just haltering one to walk up the other end of the arena, which part of it is blocked from her sight by small bushes, she is whinnying & pacing wildly in her stall non-stop until I bring them back down. For weeks now, I bring the others one by one up that end to brush them, and they are out of her sight for perhaps 10-15 minutes...and she is panicking the entire time. I have tried everything I can think of, but now it's time to shift gears & try your helpful suggestions & others here. I look forward to when I can hear the wind blow instead of all this commotion

Cheap beer, warm or chilled, whatever she will drink, to let her chill out, or try Aceing her a little in feed before you set off. Not after she gets wound up, as then it will do no good.

Just get her relaxed, and you might try radio too, if have place to put one, to break up sounds. Also, put Vicks Vaporub in nostrils, so scent will be altered.

I like the creative approach......will give everything a hefty try....thanks

What an awful situation for you to be in!
Good luck with whatever you do. (:

Thanks ever so much for the good wishes I am a strong person, and a challenge does not intimidate me....but I hope finding the solution to this situation won't take very long

[joyce-wisconsin]

Have you tried working her while someone else takes one of the others for a walk? Letting her stop if she is responsive to you and not to the missing horse? Seems simplistic, but hey ya never know what will work.

[StarfireArizona]

Originally Posted by joyce-wisconsin

Have you tried working her while someone else takes one of the others for a walk? Letting her stop if she is responsive to you and not to the missing horse? Seems simplistic, but hey ya never know what will work.

If only I had someone to help me, I could try it. It's just me and my mom, and she is a frail 76. I could work her if only they could walk themselves out Sincere thanks for trying....

[Bruce Wiley]

Originally Posted by StarfireArizona

calling out is making it almost dangerous being with the one I take out, for it constantly prompts return calls & agitation on their part. When they call out, I immediately make them circle me, changing directions, for about 30 seconds. After a couple times of this, often the calling stops.....but last night my 2 year old was horrible. The circling, backing up & HQ yields went on for over 10 minutes while the calling back continued almost uninterrupted. The night before the same went on when I walked my mare.....the constant calling, circling & backing. After returning with my colt last night, I took out my 8 year old while my mother walked the QH. My mare's antics went on for almost 2 hours while we prepared to leave & while were out. Upon returning, when I let her out of the round pen, she was so sweat encrusted & exhausted, she walked out into the arena & laid down straight out & would not get up to eat.

My question is does anyone have any suggestions of how else to handle the calling back of my walking partner ? Was I doing right with circling & HQ yields ? If this were your so called life, how would you handle it ?

Hello StarfireArizona, here are my insights on the herdbound situation.
You will only need to change some few corrections, in order to drive home your point.
Any indivdual experiencing a problem with a horse must and would need to adapt to this way of thinking, where you never allow him or them to see you sweat, carrying on with holding grudges when things don't go according to plan.
Remember, we humans must out think them as a way to be able to convince them of your idea,plan & our role.
This is easy for me to say, but difficult for you to do and by the sound of it, I feel you may have an extreme case, which will determine your next plan with them and we all hope it will become a postive outcome.

Restart your process, by only removing 1 horse at a time, keeping itself & you away from the others for just under 10 minutes at the very onstart, which you should be able to figure out on whether to increase or reduce this time period, to be able to establish a suitable starting point thats more effective and acceptable to and for them.
You must consider everything as you progress forward or otherwise like anything else, where too much or too little won't work out for the desired result, so you must find where and begin there with considering the next and each phase to perform.

I will go directly to the don'ts:
First and formost don't lunge, no backing up or even circling.
All of those things the horse can do without thinking or assoicating it's mistake or mistakes.

These are the do's:
The handler must allow the horse to comit the wrong doing, where the corrective action must then occur quickly, clearly and firmly and where the horse must be requested to disengage with crossing it's rear feet with each foot going over each other and at verved speeds into a tight half circle formation and around the handler standing position.
The handler must also ask for directional changes often until the horse quit the unwanted behavior.
As stated, you had your horse yieldings it's hind end for 10 minutes and that may have been not enough time for the horse to get your message.

2 points interests- yielding, a horse can do this movement without focusing on crossing over his feet, because they are only trying to get away with their rear ends and that should not count or be consider as the proper way to resolve this and other issues, when they move in this manner.
Now, the total disengagement technique.
Like I have already mention above and before in which the horse must cross it's rear feet over each time and this is the corrective measure which has proved it effectiveness for causing a horse to opt out of the unwanted actions.

What then take places, when the horse does the disengagement is where it has to drop it's wrong thoughts, and try not to step on itself.
Most horses soon figure this occurs when he or she has displayed a poor attitude, or has the undesireable responses etc, and where they can soon see they are the only one responsible for this hard mental & physical work so they will then surrender and experience the release of all pressure and should wait patiently for the next request from the handler.

Those frusrtating times can really get under your skin and we have all been there at one time or another but try to outlast and get pass this.

I hope this insight helps.

[StarfireArizona]

Originally Posted by Bruce Wiley

Hello StarfireArizona, here are my insights on the herdbound situation.
You will only need to change some few corrections, in order to drive home your point.
Any indivdual experiencing a problem with a horse must and would need to adapt to this way of thinking, where you never allow him or them to see you sweat, carrying on with holding grudges when things don't go according to plan.
Remember, we humans must out think them as a way to be able to convince them of your idea,plan & our role.
This is easy for me to say, but difficult for you to do and by the sound of it, I feel you may have an extreme case, which will determine your next plan with them and we all hope it will become a postive outcome.

Restart your process, by only removing 1 horse at a time, keeping itself & you away from the others for just under 10 minutes at the very onstart, which you should be able to figure out on whether to increase or reduce this time period, to be able to establish a suitable starting point thats more effective and acceptable to and for them.
You must consider everything as you progress forward or otherwise like anything else, where too much or too little won't work out for the desired result, so you must find where and begin there with considering the next and each phase to perform.

I will go directly to the don'ts:
First and formost don't lunge, no backing up or even circling.
All of those things the horse can do without thinking or assoicating it's mistake or mistakes.

These are the do's:
The handler must allow the horse to comit the wrong doing, where the corrective action must then occur quickly, clearly and firmly and where the horse must be requested to disengage with crossing it's rear feet with each foot going over each other and at verved speeds into a tight half circle formation and around the handler standing position.
The handler must also ask for directional changes often until the horse quit the unwanted behavior.
As stated, you had your horse yieldings it's hind end for 10 minutes and that may have been not enough time for the horse to get your message.

2 points interests- yielding, a horse can do this movement without focusing on crossing over his feet, because they are only trying to get away with their rear ends and that should not count or be consider as the proper way to resolve this and other issues, when they move in this manner.
Now, the total disengagement technique.
Like I have already mention above and before in which the horse must cross it's rear feet over each time and this is the corrective measure which has proved it effectiveness for causing a horse to opt out of the unwanted actions.

What then take places, when the horse does the disengagement is where it has to drop it's wrong thoughts, and try not to step on itself.
Most horses soon figure this occurs when he or she has displayed a poor attitude, or has the undesireable responses etc, and where they can soon see they are the only one responsible for this hard mental & physical work so they will then surrender and experience the release of all pressure and should wait patiently for the next request from the handler.

Those frusrtating times can really get under your skin and we have all been there at one time or another but try to outlast and get pass this.

I hope this insight helps.

Thank you Bruce....as always you get to the heart of the matter

After trying the circling & backing with my colt, I resorted to the HQ yields. They went on for a solid minute or two before he quieted down, but he did quiet down.....and then a few quick jerks on his halter kept his attention on me even though his mother was still calling.

Yes I do have an extreme case, for it is not one or two who get upset, I have 4 ! You're right, and I don't get mad or hold grudges, but I do remain assertive. There really is no other way to deal with it....

The other 3 would be no problem, if it weren't for my mare calling, and unfortunately I am out with another when she is carrying on. If I only had one other set of hands I could probably make some progress. Guess that is something to work on

Thanks so much......

[Alliekk]

So your unemployed husband cant come out to help you? I've seen you post the same topic before, I'm guessing those tricks didn't work?

If you have the facilities, tie each horse up seperately for a good hour or two per day. This will force them to go on with life without looking at the other horse. Then work on keeping your mare tied up, but moving the other three around, tying them in different places.

I really don't know what else to tell you without seeing the layout of your property. Is it just a huge open pasture? Do you have the resources to section off the field? Do you have stalls? Are they attached to your field? How many DIFFERENT areas do you have that the horses can be in without actually being turned out together? Do you have a good friend who has a big pasture that you can turn your mare out on so you can have them separated? Is selling the COLT an option? I'm trying to get a mental picture. Speaking of pictures, do you have any of your layout that can help us help you?

[Caterina]

Maybe a Vit B suppliment or a MagOx suppliment may help calm her enough to start to get used to be seperated from her buddies for short periods of time.

[StarfireArizona]

Originally Posted by Caterina

Maybe a Vit B suppliment or a MagOx suppliment may help calm her enough to start to get used to be seperated from her buddies for short periods of time.

The other day I was talking with my new (and fabulous) farrier, and I showed him the Animed Vita-Calm supp (vitamin B) I give my big gelding, and we discussed giving it to her with maybe some Valerian root mixed in. I have given her some v-root over the past couple of days & will give her the recommended dosage of the Vita-Calm (2-4 tbsp) when I will be taking one of the others out. Somethin's gotta keep her calm

In the meantime, last night I tied her up & walked my 2 year old around in a halter in the arena but quite a distance away from her. She was watching nervously & pawing, but I kept him away from her. Then I had my mother walk Desi around while I held onto Shiloh, but kept her facing the complete opposite way so she could not see where he was. She kept trying to sidestep so she could turn her head, but I sidestepped with her & kept her facing ME. After a couple minutes she sighed & brought her head down, but I knew she was still dying to look around where Desi was. It did worked well....

BUT a few minutes later I haltered Tino not far from her, and she nickered & came over close to try to make sure he wasn't leaving. I gently chased her off a couple of times. I didn't attempt to take him out due to time constraints, but if I had we would have gone through it all again I am sure....