[minilove]

This is a good thread. I agree. Besides there is no one correct way to train a horse. You take good care of your horses, they respect you, you ride well and work well with them. Your doing nothing wrong. Your open to NH as well. Everyone should be open like that with their horses. Tehe this reminds me how great HGS! The world should be like HGS! Bring up new ideas and methods, talking, debating, learning no things to improve our lives and relationships with horses!

Ok my ummm rant thing is done

[JBandRio]

Originally Posted by cowgirlnat

In a rope halter, the beginning stages of this pretty much consist of wacking your horse w/the snap with increasing intensity until they move backwards. The end result is the wiggle.

Noooo, the beginning stage is the finger wagging! The end stage, if the horse just doesn't get it/is ignoring you/is advancing instead of retreating is a hard enough swing of the rope so that the snap is making contact with his nose.

[JBandRio]

Originally Posted by HJ_lilbit

I mean someone who is a very firm believer and user of NH who would like to come and give their point of view clearer tahn already stated

Read some of my posts here

[PaintedPNH]

People's ignorance drives me crazy.

I think I'm gonna stop following this thread now.

[zomer]

Originally Posted by i_luv_wildfire

I totally agree. I'm ALL for giving pain-free cues to a horse-the FIRST time! If that doesn't work, you bet your butt I'm going to get after that horse and if it hurts, well, in Jess's words: "Bite me." That horse had a chance to do what I asked and not feel a thing. They didn't take it so you better believe I'm going to step up the cue. If that means a pop with a whip or a smack with a lead rope, then fine. I WILL yell at a horse and I WILL use a flat hand to smack them. If they jump, good. It means I got my point across.
There are times when using light, patient cues works wonders...and there are times when you have to use a little pain to get what you want. It's life.

The plain reality is we aren't causing them "pain" by a smack of the hand, lead rope or crop. It's really the sound and motion that startles them. Pain can be inflicted by the hooves and mouths of other horses, not us hairless apelike creatures. They are usually about 1200 lbs folks, do you really think we are hurting them by using a flimsy little dressage whip, a tug on a shank or a swat on the rear? I think not. I'm strong, but I aint' that strong!

[JBandRio]

Originally Posted by i_luv_wildfire

I'm ALL for giving pain-free cues to a horse-the FIRST time! If that doesn't work, you bet your butt I'm going to get after that horse and if it hurts, well, in Jess's words: "Bite me."

Ok, so what do you do when teaching, for example, your horse to back up when you touch his chest? Do you touch his chest, he has no clue what you're asking, so you haul off and wallop him? That's not very fair

[zomer]

Originally Posted by Jess!

NH is a bunch of marketing phooey. People have just cashed in on the training that people have been doing for YEARS.

Someone just slapped a name on it, called it the 'great, new method' and it went from there.

Jess, you hit the nail on the head here. I think most of us all utilize what is now branded as "NH" in our training. Years before I heard of NH, this is how everyone where I rode trained and worked their horses. So in a way, I think everyone on here agrees. What is getting people hackles up is the way the whole NH thing is touted. But you can see by most of the threads and posts on HGS in the training section, most of have been doing this stuff for our entire horsey careers. So there is no need for anyone to bash nor defend NH, because I think in our own ways with our own definitions, we are all already doing the things NH promotes. We just don't call it NH, we call it training and working with our horses.

[Kissitgoodbye]

It shouldn't matter to anyone here what someone else does with their horse(s). Its their choice. If they believe its working let them continue doing it. Its their money, and their time.

I am not saying if that I am for it or against it. But I don't believe we should be smashing this. You don't see natural horsemen SMASHING our dressage, cross country, jumping, western pleasure do you?

And I do agree though its a little hookey, but who cares if it makes someone feel good about themselves and their horses relastionship...

[Beautifulsould]

I know what you mean, Natural Horsemanship is ok,but it is taken too far! There is a NH trainer at my barn who says if the horse misbehaves that it is always to the riders fault!!! Yes sometimes it is our fault, but when a horse is not listening or bucking then it is the horses fault, they are misbehaving! Some NH trainers let their horses get away with everything. My philosphy, ask then tell then make your horse do something! NH is great, but it is really taken too far!

[Launa]

Have any of you ever read about Native American Horsemanship?