How many does it take?

Drafty1 · 11-16-2004, 09:20 AM

Ok my mare is 1/2 shire and 1/2 paint. If I bred her to a full shire my foal would be 3/4 shire, then if I bred that horse to a full shire would my foal be 7/8 shire?
What I'm asking is when do I get a full shire again?

I was talking to someone and it was brought up how neat it would be to have a full shire that was dun.

arabkid · 11-16-2004, 09:50 AM

I have no idea with those breeds but in arabs once a half arab always a half arab, you can't breed it purebred no matter how many times you breed! lol but it's probably TOTALLY different with other breeds

Gretajack · 11-16-2004, 11:00 AM

I am pretty sure that what Arabkid said about Arabs holds true for most breeds, once a cross there is no way to get pure again.

Sandra-A1 · 11-16-2004, 11:11 AM

I agree...once you breed out then no matter how many times you breed back to pure each generation is considered a partbred.

With the Half Arabian no matter the percentage it is still registered a half.

devilishjumper · 11-16-2004, 11:47 AM

It hink everyone else is right you can probably get real close but I don't think it will ever really look pure

shell · 11-16-2004, 12:12 PM

The Arab people have been doing this kind of thing for a long time. Now there is a horse called a Pintabian. The have to be no less than 99% arab. But they are still only part berds, according to the Arab horse registry. So, you would not get another pure Shire. You could start your own breed though. Maybe not. I think there is already the Spotted Draft horse registry. You could start the Dun Shire registry!

ehorse_657 · 11-16-2004, 12:57 PM

Maybe, just keep breeding to full shires, and maybe it will become a full shire.

Abbie22057 · 11-16-2004, 01:19 PM

Is there such a thing as a dun shire? I've never heard of one, although it would be cool. Some breed registries (thinking goats and cows here) will allow an animal to be registered as pure if they are 15/16ths that breed or more.

With Shorthorns, anything 3/8 to 7/8 Shorthorn is registered as Appendix Shorthorn. More than 7/8 are purebred.

Alpine dairy goats must show all breed characteristics and be at least 15/16 Alpine and they are registered as American Alpine. French Alpines are pure.
So maybe Shires are something like either of these???

timberline · 11-16-2004, 01:20 PM

Once you introduce non-Shire blood, you can never get back to pure Shire again. You can get so far as 99.9% but there will still be non-Shire blood present, even if only minute. Same goes for any breed.
The only thing is, some registries, for one reason or another, will allow approved outcrosses and still regard the offspring as pure, even though it's not.

Drafty1 · 11-16-2004, 02:02 PM

I guess it looks like I'll have to start my own breed, gee that will only take me 15 years to get the first one and thats if I get a dun filly everytime. Thats a long time to wait. Maybe down to 10 years if I get dun colts and then I have to buy shire mares. Its looking like a lifetime effort.

11-16-2004, 09:20 AM	#1
Drafty1 Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Northern California Posts: 3,406 Images: 518 Blog Entries: 1	How many does it take? Ok my mare is 1/2 shire and 1/2 paint. If I bred her to a full shire my foal would be 3/4 shire, then if I bred that horse to a full shire would my foal be 7/8 shire? What I'm asking is when do I get a full shire again? I was talking to someone and it was brought up how neat it would be to have a full shire that was dun. __________________ Yeah, I guess you were riding, until you fell off.

11-16-2004, 09:50 AM	#2
arabkid Senior Member+ Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Saskatchewan, Canada Posts: 4,633 Images: 271 Blog Entries: 17	I have no idea with those breeds but in arabs once a half arab always a half arab, you can't breed it purebred no matter how many times you breed! lol but it's probably TOTALLY different with other breeds __________________ "CON-FUCIUS SAY......YOU GO TO JAIL, BAD BOY" -Russell Peters LOL www.wunderbararabians.com

11-16-2004, 11:11 AM	#4
Sandra-A1 Senior Member+ Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Alabama Posts: 8,419 Images: 225	I agree...once you breed out then no matter how many times you breed back to pure each generation is considered a partbred. With the Half Arabian no matter the percentage it is still registered a half. __________________ "It is our choices Harry, that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities." ~Dumbledore

11-16-2004, 11:47 AM	#5
devilishjumper Senior Member+ Join Date: May 2004 Location: Pennslyvania USA Posts: 2,129 Images: 101	It hink everyone else is right you can probably get real close but I don't think it will ever really look pure __________________ ~Kim~

11-16-2004, 12:12 PM	#6
shell Senior Member+ Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: The Great North West Posts: 8,930 Images: 313	The Arab people have been doing this kind of thing for a long time. Now there is a horse called a Pintabian. The have to be no less than 99% arab. But they are still only part berds, according to the Arab horse registry. So, you would not get another pure Shire. You could start your own breed though. Maybe not. I think there is already the Spotted Draft horse registry. You could start the Dun Shire registry! __________________ “Look, what a horse should have he did not lack, save a proud rider on so proud back.” -Shakespear Marshalltown, Iowa, it is against the law for a horse to eat a fire hydrant.

11-16-2004, 11:00 AM	#3
Gretajack Senior Member+ Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 380	I am pretty sure that what Arabkid said about Arabs holds true for most breeds, once a cross there is no way to get pure again.

11-16-2004, 12:57 PM	#7
ehorse_657 Full Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Missouri Posts: 70	Maybe, just keep breeding to full shires, and maybe it will become a full shire.

11-16-2004, 01:19 PM	#8
Abbie22057 Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: GR, Michigan Posts: 1,252 Images: 2	Is there such a thing as a dun shire? I've never heard of one, although it would be cool. Some breed registries (thinking goats and cows here) will allow an animal to be registered as pure if they are 15/16ths that breed or more. With Shorthorns, anything 3/8 to 7/8 Shorthorn is registered as Appendix Shorthorn. More than 7/8 are purebred. Alpine dairy goats must show all breed characteristics and be at least 15/16 Alpine and they are registered as American Alpine. French Alpines are pure. So maybe Shires are something like either of these???

11-16-2004, 01:20 PM	#9
timberline Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 1,057 Images: 140	Once you introduce non-Shire blood, you can never get back to pure Shire again. You can get so far as 99.9% but there will still be non-Shire blood present, even if only minute. Same goes for any breed. The only thing is, some registries, for one reason or another, will allow approved outcrosses and still regard the offspring as pure, even though it's not. __________________ *Let The Evidence Speak For Itself...*

11-16-2004, 02:02 PM	#10
Drafty1 Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Northern California Posts: 3,406 Images: 518 Blog Entries: 1	I guess it looks like I'll have to start my own breed, gee that will only take me 15 years to get the first one and thats if I get a dun filly everytime. Thats a long time to wait. Maybe down to 10 years if I get dun colts and then I have to buy shire mares. Its looking like a lifetime effort. __________________ Yeah, I guess you were riding, until you fell off.