[ms robin]

Hello All,
In regards to many responding to a previous forum post called "Horse Slaughter Do you Agree". Some of you were stating well what else would we do with the unwanted horses, or sick horses if we can't afford to put them down. First if you can't afford to put an animal down humanely you should not own the animal. However here is some real facts on horse slaughter.

The slaughter industry turns horses into disposable items,* it promotes neglect.* It devalues the animals.* It promotes laziness on the part of people looking to*sell a horse.* They don't have to take the time to place a classified ad and show the horse to prospective buyers or pay to put the horse down if that's what is needed because they can just haul to the nearest auction.* Slaughter promotes horse owner irresponsibility. The auction is to the horse world what*dog pounds*are to the dog/cat world - a place to dump an animal they no longer want.* This doesn't mean the animal isn't wanted by someone else,* it's not an "unwanted" animal.* It means it's owners were just too lazy to be bothered with making the effort of finding new owners.* If a horse at an auction*doesn't sell one day (because there are no killers buying up everything) they will have to bring the horse back the following weeks and/or take out classifieds ads advertising the horse for sale.* It's that simple.*
*
Pro-slaughter thinks if they state something over and over enough that*it becomes fact but the fact is*only a*small percentage of slaughtered horses are old, lame, in need of euthanasia, etc.* The majority are young, healthy, and*in their prime*who*just had the misfortune*of being bought by the slaughter industry.* If slaughter were merely providing a service there would be no need for killer buyers to be out competitively bidding against regular horse buyers, people could bring them directly to the buyers.* They could run classified ads "We buy horses for slaughter"* - so*why don't they do this?* Because they wouldn't*get much business that way.**The fact is they have*to fill their trucks*to make their profits and that's what it's all about.* They'll buy any horse they can to fill their truck and no horse going through an auction*is safe from the killer buyer's bid - for horses it's the luck of the draw,* it's how many people show up at an auction on a given day/night -*more horses than buyers*and the killers have a*profitable day.
*
The slaughter industry must always state it costs horse owners up to $1000 to dispose of a horse.* This statement is a 'scare tactic.'* Find out the costs and options in your area and compare,* you'll find the slaughter industry quotes*are extremely inflated.* Many more horses die each year (from various ailments such as colic) than horses slaughtered in slaughterhouses,* how are they disposed of?* Think about it,* there are 6 million horses in this country and many of these horses die every day.*
*
The majority of horse owners are responsible and care enough for their horses to do the right thing.* These are the people you see advertising in classifieds and trade publications,* they want to make sure their horse goes to a responsible new owner.* They are also the people who will call their vet to treat injuries*or humanely euthanize if necessary.* Unfortunately we don't hear much about these people so*some out there*are left*to believe the propaganda put out by the slaughter industry in their attempts to defend their profitable*business.*
*
Invite*people to read information based on*facts -
*
from SAPL's website:
*
Where Would All the Horses Go? - John Hettinger, The Blood Horse Magazine, June 28, 2003, pp. 3492-3492
*
-Kimberly S. Herbert, Editor of THE HORSE in editorial "New View on Slaughter" upon reading the report "Horse Slaughter: An Unnecessary Evil," which was commissioned by the Thoroughbred Retirement Foundation.

http://www.trfinc.org/White%20Paper.doc

*?? horses were deprived of food and water because they were going to slaughter anyway.* My conclusion is that the slaughter option encourages neglect?Money is the only objective of selling horses to slaughter.* Those of us in the trenches have seen enough.?*
-Officer Pennell Hopkins, Equine Investigations, Pennsylvania Police, letter to THE HORSE, June
2002

Also please take a look at this very informative site of the facts and the current Bills trying to be passed to stop horse slaughter,provided by a wonderful lady who owns property next door to one of the horrible slaughter plants in Kaufman Texas,Dallas Crown.

http://kaufmanzoning.net/horsemeat/

Thank you,

Robin Cochran
AGAINST HORSE SLAUGHTER
running_

[Nelly]

I dont eat Horsemeat, and I never would do it.

BUT!

I think sometimes it is better to slaughter the horse, it depends on the situation.
If there is no other way I would slaughter it, if there is another one I would call the vet!

But to say that Slaughtering is a evil thing is just wrong, its just the way how you do it.

If the Horse is at home and on a safe place why not?

I never would sell a horse to a slaughter house, but at home ... yes...

[Blistering Winds]

Oh boy, here we go again. Didn't we just do this?

Anyways. Not trying to offend you or anything. So don't take me wrong.

I don't understand how Slaughter creates Irresponsible owners? 80% of the basic horse owners don't even KNOW that they can run their horse up to the slaughter house or even know that horses that don't sell above $500 to a person are sold to killers.

2, most horse owners WANT the best price for their horse if nothing else. Especially the "irresponsible" owners. They want more than $500, (which is today's rate on a 1200 lb horse). Killers won't pay BIG BUCKS for horse meat. They pay per pound. NO negotiations.

3. In todays economy, I know a few more who have not been able to sell their horses. Grade horses who are lucky to even bring in $500. They have lost their homes, they have tried giving the horses away. Well, they went to auction as a last resort because they were HOPING they wouldn't have to put a horse down just because they couldn't afford them.

GOSH, that bothers me even more than slaughter. If nothing is wrong with your horse, WHY are you putting the horse down again? At least at Auction there is a CHANCE that someone might buy the horse. But to just put a horse down because you can't feed or care for him....would you put your kid down because you can't afford them? Your dog or cat? Don't answer that because just that comment is going to open a can of worms.....

Face it. horses are LIVESTOCK. People in other countries believe us to be evil and nasty and cruel for eating cattle. There is not enough LAND to bury a horse. Or enough $$ to burn a horse. Especially if you have hit hard times.

You can't just say, well if you couldn't afford to put them down or care until they are sold, WHY do you have a horse? Many people could afford MANY horses. Probably more than most of us. They were making BIG BUCKS. We were one of those many. When 9/11 hit, the Aircraft industry was hit the HARDEST over anything. Over 60% of the Aircraft industry has been laid off to DATE and more on the way. 80% of our company was laid off. 5% of those people had horses and families. 3% still do not have jobs and have either sold their horses or sent them to Auction. THEY HAVE NO MONEY anymore. It hit us with no real warning. One day they are making 20-30 an hour with 50-60 hr weeks and overtime pay. Next day, NOTHING. So before you go bashing people for having horses when they can't afford to put them down, also think of what the situation is too. They may have HAD the money, but got hit with a lay-off and have to move, or sell, or claim bankruptcy. The horses have to be SOLD to feed the kids.

Yes, many healthy, hearty horses are going to Slaughter. Where were their lives going before they were going to slaughter? Who was going to buy them? Care for them? Killers are usually the last to buy. They buy up the ones that didn't sell. They put in only bids up to the price of the weight of the horse, and no more or they'd lose money.

Killers also set the base horse price. Did you know that? If a killer will buy a horse for $500, then that horse is at LEAST worth $500. With training, and a good disposition, you can jump his worth to around a $1000. Without killer buyers, that $500 horse is worth Nothing. So a trained, awesome horse's price would drop to around 500-1000.

The BIGGEST issue I have with slaughter is transportation. Which is changing every day. New laws are in place, cops are pulling over both horse and cattle trucks to inspect (they are getting bonuses for it from what I've heard..just rumor though..wasn't supposed to say)

It will take a bit of time, but eventually it will be better.

If you want to stop Slaughter, Stop the unnecesary breeding of back-yard "pets" who have no business breeding. They have nothing to offer the horse world, and no owners to care for them.

If we stop slaughter, where will all the un-wanted horses go? And yes, there are a LOT of un-wanted horses or un-able to be cared for horses. ESPECIALLY in today's economy. Until it picks up, sale's of horses aren't going to increase. Breeders have even cut back their breeding herds because of the economy. They've gotten a little smarter. They aren't bringing in many foals this crop year. They are loosing too much money.

Anyways, I've said my peace for now.

[QHlover]

Nelly - Have you even seen a slaughter yard?! It's horrible! These people don't care what the animal is going through. They are cruel and unusual. I heard of horses being shipped to yards with broken legs, and then just cast in a pen full of other horses. These people just don't care.

And if you have no compassion for these horses to just send them off to slaughter, then that's pretty sick in deed. There is no circumstance that requires a horse to go to slaughter. None whatsoever.

There are some horses that I agree that are holy terrors, but they don't deserve to be slaughtered. No horse does. Every horse should be given a chance. I personnally think that slaughter houses should be banned!

[spyro1]

"?? horses were deprived of food and water because they were going to slaughter anyway. My conclusion is that the slaughter option encourages neglect?Money is the only objective of selling horses to slaughter. Those of us in the trenches have seen enough.?
-Officer Pennell Hopkins, Equine Investigations, Pennsylvania Police, letter to THE HORSE, June
2002"

This makes absolutely no sense to me, why would the horses be starved if "Money is the only objective of selling horses to slaughter", the owner would get less $ because the horses are sold by *the pound*.. There are feed lots that horses go to before auction, just for the specific purpose of fattening them up for the *kill buyers*. I have probably read thousand debates surrounding this issue, and I have to agree with BW. Those that are so against slaughter, can you afford to take these *unwanted* horses and care for them for the rest of their lives?? Sorry, slaughter is necessary in my opinion, doesn't mean I like it, my horse DEFINATELY won't end up there, but for some there is no other options.

[Blistering Winds]

I've seen horses travel for 24 hrs with no food and water, but that's the longest I've EVER seen them travel, and that's been banned in the US. Same for Cattle. The last thing that killers want is for their weight to drop too much. HOrses will do it faster than cattle. So it is in their best interest to let them rest and eat/drink.

I have been to a kill yard recently and both have inacted and are complying with the laws. The pens all have feed bunkers, clean water. They are fed the day they come in, and if they don't go to "slaughter" that evening, they are fed again. There are round-bales in the yards for the horses to munch on until it is their "time".

Now we need to work on transportation and irresponsible breeders and we can get control of the slaughter industry, and slowely wean it out of the country.

I totally disagree with this statement:

"The slaughter industry turns horses into disposable items, it promotes neglect. It devalues the animals. It promotes laziness on the part of people looking to sell a horse. "

Reason for it is most people don't KNOW about slaughter, let alone how to care for their horse. 9 out of 10 abuse calls to ASPCA or the police are Neglect out of Ignorance. Not actual abuse. People are IGNORANT. NOt for the reason that if they get tired, they can sell to slaughter. If these people knew about it, they'd probably be at the slaughter house already before their horse gets all skinny and bony.

Then there are those who "SAVE A HORSE" from slaughter, only to neglect the horse and kill him "out of kindness". I'd rather see that horse at slaughter than die over several months, being starved to death, or fed wrong and founder severely, only to die again at the hands of a vet or a bullet from the owner. Course the bullet horse can still go to slaughter and recover some of the expense.

Anyways, I'm rambling on again.

[Nelly]

QHlover:
Nelly - Have you even seen a slaughter yard?! It's horrible! These people don't care what the animal is going through. They are cruel and unusual. I heard of horses being shipped to yards with broken legs, and then just cast in a pen full of other horses. These people just don't care.

And if you have no compassion for these horses to just send them off to slaughter, then that's pretty sick in deed. There is no circumstance that requires a horse to go to slaughter. None whatsoever.

There are some horses that I agree that are holy terrors, but they don't deserve to be slaughtered. No horse does. Every horse should be given a chance. I personnally think that slaughter houses should be banned!

I never said that I would send my horse into a Slaughter House!
No one of my famaly would do that, but once we had to shoot a horse, cause we didnt get the vet, and with that they had to slaughter it!
In Germany we have a different system like in the states or on another place!
And if there would be not another way without to shoot, I would de shoot my horse before it would have to suffer!
And the real terror is to let suffer a horse!
I never would sell it into a slaughter house..

[space_cowboy]

I agree with BW. The horse industry sucks right now. Everyone is breeding everything to anything. It makes those of us who are very careful about breeding and training suffer. I had to decrease my heard this year and drop the prices of some of my horses. I have horses that should have sold for about 10k that I had to take half the price for.

It is sad - but it's life. I do go to auction and save some horses but there are only so many you can save - and I am sorry but I cannot save the ones who will never be sound or sane.

[Estelle]

I have to say that one thing that really irritates me are the horse "elitists" I personally prefer grade horses and lots of folks feel that way. Actually if you study the statistics there are triple the amount of people who own grade horses then own high priced papered ones. So now you tell me, which horses are the wanted ones? According to those facts, its the grades. I get so sick of hearing people talk about people breeding grade horses being so wrong, they are wrong alright, but no more wrong then someone who breeds horses worth 5,000, 10,000 dollars or more...overbreeding is overbreeding period and if the horses being bred are well put together I couldnt care less if it was a purebred or not...and I find the attitude of folks like that very snobby and elitist and it makes me sick everytime I read a post like that. I do not breed, have never bred and will never breed a horse as the market is overwhelmed as it is. Im hoping that slaughter will be outlawed and that EVERYONE who breeds horses will start to use their heads.

[Blistering Winds]

No...don't take me wrong. I've had some excellent "grade" horses. The ones I'm talking about are the sickled hock, long neck, freaky creatures who sit in a backyard and chew up everything. So the owner decides....Hey, if I breed her, she'll calm down. Or..>I want a foal, well, I have a mare here, friend has a stud (who is as freaky as the mare) and they breed and get an even FREAKER foal.