Herd Bound

Fipps · 01-23-2005, 02:57 PM

I have a 13 yr old morgan gelding who I have owned for about 15months. He was very unhappy and had many undesirable behaviors until this summer when we purchased an old pony and an old gelding. He loves them both and it now getting to the point that he is obsessed with them both. I took him out for a walk the other day (too icy to ride) and as we got away from the barn he reared and hit me on the head with a hoof. Scared me to death. I am afraid if I just maintain the status quo for the rest of the winter, he will be really dangerous by spring. I am seriously considering selling him, as I have a 4yr old daughter who keeps me from riding, as he takes so much constant re-training. The former owners didn't do anything with him for 3 years prior to my purchasing him. Am feeling hopeless about being able to bring him around. Anyone have any ideas for me?
Horsemom

Lucy99 · 01-23-2005, 03:02 PM

Could you not maybe find someone who could ride him for you a few times a week, that way he gets exercise even when you do not have the time?

mindu · 01-23-2005, 04:03 PM

Fipps you sound alot like me. I have a 4 year old daughter who keeps me from riding and a horse with seperation anxiety!

I try to spend some time everyday working with them. I have several horses. But you really can get something done in 5-15 minute sessions.

With the buddy sour you have a couple things going on.One is you know your horse gets upset when he gets to far from his buddies.The other is he's showing you how he is going to behave any time he reaches that level of anxiety. So you don't want to just get him ok with being away from his buddies. Thats part of it.You also want to train him to respond to you even if he is upset.

You can do alot of work on this on the ground. One thing you could start with is to teach your horse to drop is head from downward pressure on the lead. Teach him how to do it while he's standing right next to his buddies. Once you think he's got it you can start gradually moving away from them. Tie up the buddies so they don't take off and get him too upset. You could start with just circling away from them 5 feet and go right back to them. You don't want to go to far.You want to just get him a little upset.Not so upset that you loose control. Now you are adding excitement and testing how well he can respond to you. Try to keep his head elevation level with his withers or below. If he raises his head ask him to drop it. Once he seems to be performing well at that distance move off a little further and back. Practice your cues while you are making your trips back and forth.Gradually build the distance and time.Dropping his head will help keep him calm too.

You can use this same stratagy to teach all your cues. Practice leading in a perfect position. You'll be working on your stop and back and go forward, and turns. You can use the same ideas riding.The main thing is find a place you are in control and start there.Gradually build. If you loose control or he gets to upset just go back and work at the last place you had success.Keep him busy responding to you the whole time.

Hope that helps.Its helped me and my mare. There are probably ways of doing it faster, but my main concern is saftey and not having a fight with my horse so thats why I chose to use this approach.

WhisperingStar · 01-23-2005, 07:45 PM

Here is what I would do. Take him as far as his his comfort level allows and then increase the distance everyday by a few feet. By comfort level I mean, as far as he will go witout getting really upset. Let him graze, play with him, pet him , talk to him, give him a treat, like a carrot , horse treat , apple. Make him feel comfortable with you. Do not be nervous with him or he wil sense that and figure that there is something to be nervous of and get upset. Work on that everyday till you can walk totally out of sight of the other horse, and then go further, to the point where he can no longer hear them and he is no longer calling them. This may take a few weeks even months but it is worth it and it is not a dangerous way of doing it, you are not pushing to hard to fast this way.

Hope that helps. Good luck and keep us informed.

Fipps · 01-24-2005, 04:51 PM

Thanks for all the tips. My main problem right now is the ice at our house. His stall is the only place that it isn't icy. I have a lead on a trainer who has access to an indoor arena and he is considering taking him for 2-3mo and we will see what kind of success he has with him. I am praying that the trainer will take him for awhile to jump start the retraining process. I think that when the previous owners did nothing with him for 3 years, his training just flew the coop! Right now I don't trust him enough to have anyone else ride him-I tried to get several people to do that this summer, and they are too busy too. He needs an experienced rider. I'll keep you posted!

Cara · 01-27-2005, 02:16 PM

Hi, I have a 14 year old Quarter Horse, who was put out with a little mare a while back. After a couple of days, he was obsesed. When I took him out of her sight, he would rear, and totally flip out. I just mainly worked him in the round pen a lot until he finally started to listen to me and my body language, instead of neighing at his friend, and prancing around, and "spooking", etc. Then I took him out on with his halter and worked him in a lot of circles and such, everywhere - including right by his pasture, and far away from his pasture - until, again he started listening to me. I did this over the course of a week or so, and by then he was still a little nervous by himself, but got over it in a minute or two. Now he's in with a gelding instead though, and he doesn't get attatched.

I have a friend who had the same thing happen, and that horse just ended up living by it's self, because she didn't have the time to deal with him.

Anyway - that's what I did and it worked, so I hope this helps

~ Cara

KZWestern · 01-27-2005, 04:13 PM

I know this doesn't sound like it would work, but Isis's extreme buddy sourness (like yours... rearing, fighting, squealing) was fixed within the first week that I started doing Parelli's program... Nothing special, somehow the training just did it for me.

Fipps · 01-29-2005, 03:37 AM

What is Parelli''s Program?

Cara · 01-29-2005, 07:32 AM

go to
http://parelli.parellinet.net/
it has a lot of info, I personally have not done parelli's 7 games, but I've worked with a lot of people who have, and who have trained me in the basics, I have trained a lot under Richard Winters, here's his site if you want it.
http://www.wintersranch.com/

hope these help!

~ Cara

John · 01-29-2005, 08:06 AM

This problem here is that your horse does not respect you period.In order to train or have the type of relationship with your horse that everyone dreams of HE MUST RESPECT YOU. As a herd animal he now feels more comfortable with his stall mate. There are several ways to acomplish the needed change.I feel that the best is work work work. A round pen if you have it or a lunge line but be firm!!!!! Post #16 by Cara is the idea but dont try bribing and get it over with as fast as possible. Going slowly just gives him the oportunity to try ducking out and is harder on everyone. You must be the meanest horse on the block and then he will think that you are great. Then you can develop the kind of relationship that you want!!!

01-27-2005, 02:16 PM	#6
Cara Senior Member+ Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: California Posts: 3,721 Images: 27	Hi, I have a 14 year old Quarter Horse, who was put out with a little mare a while back. After a couple of days, he was obsesed. When I took him out of her sight, he would rear, and totally flip out. I just mainly worked him in the round pen a lot until he finally started to listen to me and my body language, instead of neighing at his friend, and prancing around, and "spooking", etc. Then I took him out on with his halter and worked him in a lot of circles and such, everywhere - including right by his pasture, and far away from his pasture - until, again he started listening to me. I did this over the course of a week or so, and by then he was still a little nervous by himself, but got over it in a minute or two. Now he's in with a gelding instead though, and he doesn't get attatched. I have a friend who had the same thing happen, and that horse just ended up living by it's self, because she didn't have the time to deal with him. Anyway - that's what I did and it worked, so I hope this helps ~ Cara __________________ ~It Depends~ Cara ~ http://dressagecowgrl.blogspot.com ~

01-27-2005, 04:13 PM	#7
KZWestern Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 3,642 Images: 35	I know this doesn't sound like it would work, but Isis's extreme buddy sourness (like yours... rearing, fighting, squealing) was fixed within the first week that I started doing Parelli's program... Nothing special, somehow the training just did it for me. __________________ Kristie + Isis = Krisis!!!!!!!!! Isis - slaughter rescue Grattitude - Swedish Warmblood

01-29-2005, 07:32 AM	#9
Cara Senior Member+ Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: California Posts: 3,721 Images: 27	go to http://parelli.parellinet.net/ it has a lot of info, I personally have not done parelli's 7 games, but I've worked with a lot of people who have, and who have trained me in the basics, I have trained a lot under Richard Winters, here's his site if you want it. http://www.wintersranch.com/ hope these help! ~ Cara __________________ ~It Depends~ Cara ~ http://dressagecowgrl.blogspot.com ~

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01-23-2005, 02:57 PM	#1
Fipps Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3	Herd Bound I have a 13 yr old morgan gelding who I have owned for about 15months. He was very unhappy and had many undesirable behaviors until this summer when we purchased an old pony and an old gelding. He loves them both and it now getting to the point that he is obsessed with them both. I took him out for a walk the other day (too icy to ride) and as we got away from the barn he reared and hit me on the head with a hoof. Scared me to death. I am afraid if I just maintain the status quo for the rest of the winter, he will be really dangerous by spring. I am seriously considering selling him, as I have a 4yr old daughter who keeps me from riding, as he takes so much constant re-training. The former owners didn't do anything with him for 3 years prior to my purchasing him. Am feeling hopeless about being able to bring him around. Anyone have any ideas for me? Horsemom

01-23-2005, 03:02 PM	#2
Lucy99 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: South of France Posts: 253 Images: 15	Could you not maybe find someone who could ride him for you a few times a week, that way he gets exercise even when you do not have the time?

01-23-2005, 04:03 PM	#3
mindu Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 11	Fipps you sound alot like me. I have a 4 year old daughter who keeps me from riding and a horse with seperation anxiety! I try to spend some time everyday working with them. I have several horses. But you really can get something done in 5-15 minute sessions. With the buddy sour you have a couple things going on.One is you know your horse gets upset when he gets to far from his buddies.The other is he's showing you how he is going to behave any time he reaches that level of anxiety. So you don't want to just get him ok with being away from his buddies. Thats part of it.You also want to train him to respond to you even if he is upset. You can do alot of work on this on the ground. One thing you could start with is to teach your horse to drop is head from downward pressure on the lead. Teach him how to do it while he's standing right next to his buddies. Once you think he's got it you can start gradually moving away from them. Tie up the buddies so they don't take off and get him too upset. You could start with just circling away from them 5 feet and go right back to them. You don't want to go to far.You want to just get him a little upset.Not so upset that you loose control. Now you are adding excitement and testing how well he can respond to you. Try to keep his head elevation level with his withers or below. If he raises his head ask him to drop it. Once he seems to be performing well at that distance move off a little further and back. Practice your cues while you are making your trips back and forth.Gradually build the distance and time.Dropping his head will help keep him calm too. You can use this same stratagy to teach all your cues. Practice leading in a perfect position. You'll be working on your stop and back and go forward, and turns. You can use the same ideas riding.The main thing is find a place you are in control and start there.Gradually build. If you loose control or he gets to upset just go back and work at the last place you had success.Keep him busy responding to you the whole time. Hope that helps.Its helped me and my mare. There are probably ways of doing it faster, but my main concern is saftey and not having a fight with my horse so thats why I chose to use this approach.

01-23-2005, 07:45 PM	#4
WhisperingStar Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Manitoba, Canada Posts: 416 Images: 11	Here is what I would do. Take him as far as his his comfort level allows and then increase the distance everyday by a few feet. By comfort level I mean, as far as he will go witout getting really upset. Let him graze, play with him, pet him , talk to him, give him a treat, like a carrot , horse treat , apple. Make him feel comfortable with you. Do not be nervous with him or he wil sense that and figure that there is something to be nervous of and get upset. Work on that everyday till you can walk totally out of sight of the other horse, and then go further, to the point where he can no longer hear them and he is no longer calling them. This may take a few weeks even months but it is worth it and it is not a dangerous way of doing it, you are not pushing to hard to fast this way. Hope that helps. Good luck and keep us informed.

01-24-2005, 04:51 PM	#5
Fipps Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3	Thanks for all the tips. My main problem right now is the ice at our house. His stall is the only place that it isn't icy. I have a lead on a trainer who has access to an indoor arena and he is considering taking him for 2-3mo and we will see what kind of success he has with him. I am praying that the trainer will take him for awhile to jump start the retraining process. I think that when the previous owners did nothing with him for 3 years, his training just flew the coop! Right now I don't trust him enough to have anyone else ride him-I tried to get several people to do that this summer, and they are too busy too. He needs an experienced rider. I'll keep you posted!

01-29-2005, 03:37 AM	#8
Fipps Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3	What is Parelli''s Program?

01-29-2005, 08:06 AM	#10
John Senior Member+ Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: B.C. Canada Posts: 3,307 Images: 35	This problem here is that your horse does not respect you period.In order to train or have the type of relationship with your horse that everyone dreams of HE MUST RESPECT YOU. As a herd animal he now feels more comfortable with his stall mate. There are several ways to acomplish the needed change.I feel that the best is work work work. A round pen if you have it or a lunge line but be firm!!!!! Post #16 by Cara is the idea but dont try bribing and get it over with as fast as possible. Going slowly just gives him the oportunity to try ducking out and is harder on everyone. You must be the meanest horse on the block and then he will think that you are great. Then you can develop the kind of relationship that you want!!!