[Lindsayanne]

Just wanted to start a thread to get some tips on handling foals/weanlings/yearlings when they are acting up. What are your tricks?

Do you ever use a stud chain? If so when do you introduce it?


(lol, anyone who saw my thread about the vet prescribing stall rest and handwalking for an 8mo weanling should have seen this thread coming )

Kawai is doing as fantastically as anyone could reasonably hope for a baby on 24/7 stall rest, but she has been testing me some. On day 3 she had her first real tantrum and I got kicked in the process. I can't turn her sharply because of the injury, and I'm not sure it's okay to back her up, so I introduced her to Mr. Stud Chain and once properly introduced, when Mr. Stud Chain is in town she tests much, much less and gives up much, much more quickly.


When the babies spook or pull back I was taught to just let them out to the end of their lead rope, and then gather them back up- but that's how I manged to get kicked (I let her out to the end of the rope when she yanked, but then she spun and caught me- I'm not sure if she was aiming for me but I disciplined her like she was!)


Anyway, just from the super stressful situation the Wean Beans are in this week (both on stall rest, Deb still less than a week weaned) They've been testing me and we've been exploring aaaaaall our discipline options. (But we're really doing quite well! Kawai hardly tries now and Debutante whinnies every time I come out the back door, which makes me warm and fuzzy. )

[IIIBarsV]

I'd recommend a rope halter for Kawai. It's less scary and less severe than a chain, and will also apply the pressure where you need it, not where you don't need it. She will learn nothing from a chain except that it hurts and when it comes off, she can do whatever she wants until the chain goes back on.

With a rope halter, she will learn to give to pressure instead of fighting it, and she's less likely to panic with one on, or get hurt.

[Lindsayanne]

Originally Posted by IIIBarsV

I'd recommend a rope halter for Kawai. It's less scary and less severe than a chain,

IMO There is nothing particularly scary or (more) severe (than a rope halter) about a properly used stud chain.

and will also apply the pressure where you need it, not where you don't need it.

Could you be more specific?

She will learn nothing from a chain except that it hurts and when it comes off, she can do whatever she wants until the chain goes back on.

Why is a rope halter different? Don't they learn the difference between a flat halter and a rope halter too?

[idlewild]

Originally Posted by Lindsayanne

Why is a rope halter different? Don't they learn the difference between a flat halter and a rope halter too?

Yup, that they do

IMO, the difference between a rope halter and a chain is that a rope halter can be used for more general everyday use such a tying, wheras a chain you cannot tie with. Also, I think a chain gives a tad bit more bite than a rope halter, thus more control.

But either way, both are useful tools when used correctly

I remember when I halter broke babies and if they threw a tantrum at times it was just hang on for dear life and not let them get away. I can't say I ever did a lot of ground manners with babies, my trainer normally ended up doing that, I just got handed the dirty work of halter breaking them

[Caterina]

Originally Posted by IIIBarsV

I'd recommend a rope halter for Kawai. It's less scary and less severe than a chain, and will also apply the pressure where you need it, not where you don't need it. She will learn nothing from a chain except that it hurts and when it comes off, she can do whatever she wants until the chain goes back on.

With a rope halter, she will learn to give to pressure instead of fighting it, and she's less likely to panic with one on, or get hurt.

I dont quite agree with this statement, most horses do learn... and will transfer to when the chain comes off....

[bay_blnd jmpr07]

Mars learned back pretty early. If he acted up he got moved backwards, and fast, this is when he would try to blow past me on lead.

I also did circles away from me (pivoting basically). Pivot on the forehand and pivot on the haunches. Where ever my pressure is coming from, whatever body part it's going towards MUST move away from me imediatly and quickly.

I used a stud chain on him (still do) but he NEVER responded to it over the nose, so under the chin it went. It works for him. He respects it better. I started with a chain and can use a rope halter on him just as easily. He knows that when I have to resort to a yank, no matter if he's in a rope halter, regular nylon/leather halter, or with a chain, it means he's being bad and needs to quit. And he does.

When he starts acting like a fruitloop I normally "go after" his rear and make him turn and turn and turn. And it's all fast paced. After several turns I back him up a few steps then back him off me and make him stand at the end of my rope. By this time he's thinking "Oh no, mom's upset, I was bad" and will stand there. I'll then reel him in, give him a quick pat and start off on whatever we were doing. This all only takes a minute.

[PaintedRocket]

I haven't tried a chain but have thought about it.

When B-Baby learned she can rear and strike with her front feet.. I pull her head down and back her up so fast she never knew what hit her... unless it was the end of the lead rope I would smack her with on her shoulder with a firm "NO!"...all at once. We would do circles and walk on.. and if she threw a fit again, same thing.. NO, smack, back up/circles...

She didnt throw a fit today but she did strike me on the elbow a few days ago.. hurt somethin' fierce that's for sure.

I had ment to get a tire inner-tube to tie to the pole I normally tie her to..so when Blanky Monster (which = Velcro Monster) pulled back when tied, it would have more give..and she could pull and pull until she realises she isn't going anywhere..

However, I hadn't been able to get one..but she has since learned to stand still when velcro comes on and off.. tosses her head a bit but that is it now. She even lets me take it off w/o being tied..

[JBandRio]

Originally Posted by Lindsayanne

Why is a rope halter different? Don't they learn the difference between a flat halter and a rope halter too?

Sure they can learn the difference. But if the training in the rope halter is done PROPERLY, it doesn't matter whether it's a rope halter, flat leather halter, or a rope around their neck. Training is not about "behave while this piece of equipment is one you, but doesn't matter what you do with that piece". Training isn't about only being able to control a horse because there's a chain on his nose. We ALL know someone whose horse behaves like an angel with a chain, but a moron without. Those horses are "equipment trained", not truly trained. That is NOT to say that the chain, for example, can't and shouldn't come out when the atmosphere gets heated, if that's necessary for safety. Adrenaline has a huge impact on some horses, and if the equipment has to rise to the level of adrenaline for everyone's sake, then so be it, but realize that this presents you with another level of opportunity for training.

[buck1173]

Originally Posted by JBandRio

We ALL know someone whose horse behaves like an angel with a chain, but a moron without. Those horses are "equipment trained", not truly trained.

That is NOT to say that the chain, for example, can't and shouldn't come out when the atmosphere gets heated, if that's necessary for safety.

Adrenaline has a huge impact on some horses, and if the equipment has to rise to the level of adrenaline for everyone's sake, then so be it, but realize that this presents you with another level of opportunity for training.

JB, you beat me again!!! you're right, very busy weekend, had my first truly lovely ride on my morgan...

Lindsayanne, as JB points out, episodes of naughty behavior are really golden opportunities to see where the gaps in the foundation are... every cloud has a silver lining so to speak...

I'm not a personal fan of stud chains because to me it just illustrates a gap in understanding, but I pass no judgment on those who choose to use them, as safety is always priority #1 to me.

And, good for you for saying "Kawai is doing as fantastically as anyone could reasonably hope for a baby on 24/7 stall rest," as you realize that its emotionally difficult for a baby to be pent up.

What you could do, while in their stalls with them, practice on yielding exercises with a halter and lead.... soften and release stuff... so your babies can learn what their responsibilities are with a lead rope and handler.... this can be done just standing still, in the stall, with no turning or yanking or circling required.

Also, if you can make the time, spend time with them in their stalls exercising their brains... sack them out to saddle pads, the feeling of a girth (use a lead rope), ropes around their feet, under their tails... maybe do some clicker training, softening to the side, yielding shoulders and hips, backing on command, facing you on command (my favorite) etc.... there's a zillion things you can do with a lame horse.... ask me how I know.

Get their brains working for you as much as you can in quiet situations, and then the brain will come around to work for you (little by little) as excitement levels rise.

Maybe spend 10-20 min working on yielding and softening in their stalls before taking them out... up your chances for success.

good luck!

[BklynCwgrl]

We did/do use chains on our unruly horses...yearlings and others. For me...it is the great equalizer. When they are smaller, we use it on the nose and attach the lead rope to it under the chin...in other words it's just folded over the nose (if that makes sense).