[MuckMuck]

Originally Posted by Outlaws_Gunn

MuckMuck:
When the bits in, he messes w it for a few then stops.

ColorMyWorld:
Yes, that's what I told my mom about the treats and she stopped then. But, I've tried the crop and whip and giving him a good smack. He stopped for a while, but as soon as I thought he was finally learning, he did it again. I normally carry a 5' cane pole around w me, but I don't 'always'. I'll get my crop, though, and use it again.

sorrell:
I did this with a fork and he just bit me somewhere else. :/
Ss farm told me about the potatoe thing. I'm thinking about trying that.

So, thank you all. I don't mean to seem like I'm shooting down everyone. But, I've tried almost all of these options and he still does it. I'm open to anything, though. And I may try some others again.

OG,
Could you please expand on this a little.
Does he stop biting when he has a bit in his mouth?

[belsenj]

Have you ever put this horse in the round pen? If not, it sounds like he needs some good lessons on respect and that is where you will get some of it. Also, if there are certain circumstances where the horse only does it, why not put a grazing muzzle on him when you know when those circumstances will be coming up?

[Outlaws_Gunn]

Sorry that was so vauge.
Well...he does stop for a little while. Now that I think about it, he does seem to bite 'less' with it in his mouth, but he doesn't stop.
I was thinking about buying a jolly ball and hang it up when I groom/ tack him. Also, he does stop completely if I have a net with some hay in it. But, that's because he's too occupied with eating.
Out of everything I've tried, the hay is the ONLY thing that will make him stop biting.

Yeah, he's been in the round pen many many many times. He never stopped and since I don't have all of my panels anymore, I don't have a round pen at the moment. But, we have been working on respect training on the longe.

[MuckMuck]

OK,
Let me be a little more specific.

You go out to his stall and put a nose band on and then a snaffle bit in his mouth.
Will he try to bit you with this set up?

You turn him out into a pasture with this setup.....will he run over and try to bite you or something else?

Is it better in an hour?

How about two hours?

[EVOO]

Correct me if I am mistaken, but this horse has had a multitude of respect related behavior issue before, right? You've posted about him on a couple of occasions? And if I'm thinking of the right horse/owner/mother combination your mom is basically the gelding's personal welcome mat?

How are his other behavioral issues coming?

Here's the thing. Even if she's no longer feeding him treats, if she is not communicating to him on no uncertain terms that respect and only respect is the way to treat humans it's not going to get better. You may break him of biting but he's likely to just move on to another way of disrespecting people. And another way after that, and another after that.

When it comes right down to it, until your mom grows a backbone with this horse she is going to continue to encourage the very behaviors you are trying to get rid of. If she cannot do that (and I honestly don't think I've seen a post from you in a while on this so maybe you are making some progress?) then the best thing for you, your mom and the horse is to place him in a home with a firmer hand and replace him with a horse that is not going to push and test all of the time.

[Outlaws_Gunn]

MuckMuck:
It doesn't make a difference. I've done what you said and no, he still tries to bite. I don't turn him out w it, but I've had him bridled for two hours while I was messing w other horses around him, and he still tried to bite me every chance he got.

EVOO:
Yep! Same horse. And, yeah, my mom pretty much did let him walk all over her. He's gotten MUCH MUCH better. She doesn't even mess with him anymore. On occasion she might come out and help me groom, but it only lasts about 10 mins. :/ But, she has stopped letting him push her around. She's almost 'too' rough, now, but he listens and knows we all mean business.
I don't think he's going anywhere for a while, as he's turned into a really good boy (besides a few things). I've been doing a lot of respect training and he is FINALLY starting to get it.

[Coaco]

Have you had him checked for ulcers???? it sounds like a good fit for the behavior you are discribing. as when he is eating he is not soo crabby. and it would be long term as you say.

as for dealling with normal mouthy ness dich the crops and us your hand on his offending bit( ie. his mouth) horses will disipline the "part" that offends them on anouther.

[MuckMuck]

From everything that you have described about this horse,
He needs MORE work.
He needs to be ridden until he is tired,and I don't mean a little glow of sweat.
He needs to work at the lope and be put away tired.

How much is the horse REALLY being ridden?
How long is he being ridden and don't include tacking up.
What is his schedule in a week?

[sorrell]

Originally Posted by Coaco

Have you had him checked for ulcers???? it sounds like a good fit for the behavior you are discribing. as when he is eating he is not soo crabby. and it would be long term as you say.

as for dealling with normal mouthy ness dich the crops and us your hand on his offending bit( ie. his mouth) horses will disipline the "part" that offends them on anouther.

I would also see what irritates him most to cause the behavior, even checking his teeth. One thing I like to do with new horses is to do a full body massage on them... see where they are ticklish, where they pin their ears back, what they like, if they resist being touched in some places, etc.
If the saddle is pinching. If there is tail swinging, etc. they all might indicate irritation someplace that encourages, if not causes the biting.
A strong, awwhnnt, and finger pointing and doing something that causes discomfort or reinforces you have power over the horse, like circling, backing, moving sideways, etc. may also have a positive effect to discourage biting.
I just got a goat who loves to jump into any open door and step all over things and immediates grab paper and rip it. I have been grabbing her collar, saying "AWWNNNTT" loudly and redircting her away from the areas she is not supposed to be in and now all I have to do is point my finger and do the awwnnt thing and she cringes and looks for an escape route! She is starting to catch on that what she is doing is "wrong". I think that is the first step. The second step is teaching them there are negative consequences for negative actions and positive consequences for desired actions.
It sounds bad, but I think I would be tempted to rig a muzzle with something like a cold wet sponge a few inches away from the horse's mouth, so if he tried to bite, it would force the sponge to hit his teeth and hopefull be unpleasant, but in all honesty, those kinds of fixes only work when they are present and you need something that will stop the behavior all together.

Maybe just try standing next to him with something like a large wet sponge and if he tries to bite, push the sponge in his mouth, then when he stands for one minute without trying to bite, praise him and scratch a favorite spot. I don't think the sponge would be fun to bite... nothing to really grip, and it would not cause pain, just wouldn't be rewarding I would think.

[threehearts]

Too make a long story short, I had bought a 3yr old that I tried several times and showed no aggression. I get him home and he started biting, eveything in sight. The worst was he caught me off guard and cornered me. Lunged at me and bit my chest. Thank god I had on a bra, tshirt, turtleneck, sweatshirt and 2 jackets or I could imagine what he really would have done. I ended up having surgery to remove the hematoma that wouldnt go away.
I decided after that no more biting of anything. I used the butt end of the short bat I rode with and smacked him on the side of the mouth(where the bit goes) its very sensitive. I'll tell you I think after about 6-7 times he didnt do it anymore, when I did hit him I hit him with all my might so he would realize I wasnt playing around. He turned out to be a great horse but I was really on the fence about him for awhile.
Good Luck but mean business whatever you choose, you dont want to get seriously hurt