Gahh...Getting so frusterated...please help!

JBandRio · 10-15-2009, 06:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazzyJockey

i am a fine rider. she was doing this with her PRIOR owner which is why they got rid of her

i am a very relaxed rider and use natural horsemanship (kill me now

). i hate using the bit at all and usually ride my horses in halters. i think that was rather rude to be honest.

It was not rude at all - sit back and pretend this thread was posted by someone else, and re-read that comment with open eyes. It was stated VERY tactfully so as to not assume.

Why don't you treat this horse as if she's never been started? There are obvious holes in her training, and all you're doing at the moment is looking to patch them. So far you haven't indicated anything about trying to actually fix them.

Start. Over.

Why the

at using NH? What's wrong with that? If your techniques have worked in the past, why not go back to that? Why not have your goal to be able to walk her around in a halter like you've done with other horses? Do what it takes to get there - that will fix your holes.

Quote:

OF COURSE i know how to ground drive.

"OF COURSE"??!! You expect anyone here to know everything you do and don't know how to do, and how well you can or can't do it?

Quote:

her ground manners are impeccable.

That's awesome - that's a really helpful place to start. HAVE you ever ground driven her? If not, try it. If you have, what have her reactions been and what have you asked her to do?

Quote:

i have had enough "advice". thank-you so much

i was just trying to get tips before taking her to my trainer.

Well then I'm not really sure what you posted this thread for. Nothing rude has been said to you - you've been the rude, unappreciative person here.

So, either don't come back to this thread, or come back having taken several very big, deep breaths with an unemotional read on what has been said and asked of you.

You are taking this WAY too personally, and that never, ever bodes well for the horse. The sooner you realize that nobody on this thread was rude, that every suggestion and question was geared at trying to gain a better understanding of your knowledge and experience, as well as the horse's background, the sooner you will be able to start reading for actual content.

JazzyJockey · 10-15-2009, 07:14 AM

jbandrio that was directed toward jeep...don't get your feathers all ruffled.

i wont ask for advice anymore,okay? so sorry to anyone offended by my short reply. i have already tried what was suggested (except for the bit) so i was really trying to get opinions on that. i said i was a "fine" rider. i didn't say i was excellent or the best or even "good". i mean i have been riding my whole life and am not an idiot on a horse. i think that makes sense,huh? anyways, i am done with this thread. just wanted to say i am sorry if i offended anyone...i didn't mean to. This horse had this problem from day one i got her which is what i have been trying to explain. it is the horses problem and why her old owners coudn't keep her. i have been working with her everday the weather permits and she is getting a little better. only because i am constantly holding her back,though. i think a bit change may be in order,but i will do more research on it. i think it is silly to automatically start saying that "oh..no...every horse problem is the riders the horse is never at fault for anything". that is obviously not true. her old owner was trying to have her husband ride her on trails and she kept bolting and he kept falling. and what was saying about the half-rearing...if she is trying to take off and i pull back on the reins and make her walk THAT is when she starts to the half-rears and snorting and trying to walk faster and faster. she hates to be held back at all and from what i know from her she either gets her rider off or gets her way. i just didn't want to give up on a horse most others have. anyways, so sorry. i won't waste my time or yours anymore.

JBandRio · 10-15-2009, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazzyJockey

jbandrio that was directed toward jeep...don't get your feathers all ruffled.

Sorry, my feathers DO get ruffled when someone who is trying to help is treated in that manner

Quote:

i wont ask for advice anymore,okay?

Why? Does it really bother you that there just might be something you aren't doing right, or could be doing better/differently?

Quote:

so sorry to anyone offended by my short reply. i have already tried what was suggested (except for the bit) so i was really trying to get opinions on that. i said i was a "fine" rider. i didn't say i was excellent or the best or even "good". i mean i have been riding my whole life and am not an idiot on a horse. i think that makes sense,huh? anyways, i am done with this thread. just wanted to say i am sorry if i offended anyone...i didn't mean to. This horse had this problem from day one i got her which is what i have been trying to explain. it is the horses problem and why her old owners coudn't keep her. i have been working with her everday the weather permits and she is getting a little better. only because i am constantly holding her back,though. i think a bit change may be in order,but i will do more research on it.

Constantly holding a horse back is never an answer, and it *will* end up with a horse who responds less and less, needing more and more pressure, causing the bit to get bigger and more harsh.

Quote:

i think it is silly to automatically start saying that "oh..no...every horse problem is the riders the horse is never at fault for anything". that is obviously not true. her old owner was trying to have her husband ride her on trails and she kept bolting and he kept falling. and what was saying about the half-rearing...if she is trying to take off and i pull back on the reins and make her walk THAT is when she starts to the half-rears and snorting and trying to walk faster and faster. she hates to be held back at all and from what i know from her she either gets her rider off or gets her way. i just didn't want to give up on a horse most others have. anyways, so sorry. i won't waste my time or yours anymore.

Until you realize this IS a rider issue, a training issue, a re-teaching issue, and not the horse intentionally being a snot, intentionally doing the "wrong" things, you won't be able to fix the problems. The horse you describe is very, very common, and that horse is caused by, at some point in the way-back, poor riding.

It. Is. Not. Her. Fault.

It IS the fault of past humans. It is now the job of current humans to teach her appropriate behavior.

jedy · 10-15-2009, 09:25 AM

How peculiar, really. I can't see what's so upsetting.

Jumpergem · 10-15-2009, 03:48 PM

Try turning her out before you ride, and let her play and get the energy out, and so she is a little tired then let her calm down. Then lunge her so she is a little calmer and a bit more tired, and really try and get her to just walk, alot! And if she is really good with that, you could ride her for abut 5-15 minutes and just have her walk. And make sure that you are calm as well, and not squeezing with your legs, and not tenseing up.

JBandRio · 10-15-2009, 06:25 PM

Lunging to tire a horse out rarely ends up benefitting either party. It makes the horse more fit, which then means more lunging to get the energy level down, which makes the horse more fit, etc.

It's not likely this is an energy issue. Yes, this horse may be a high energy horse, but that isn't the issue- the issue is mental relaxation so that training can begin.

angie j · 10-16-2009, 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBandRio

Lunging to tire a horse out rarely ends up benefitting either party....
It's not likely this is an energy issue. .. the issue is mental relaxation so that training can begin.

THis is interesting. I've noticed ALOT of people who believe lunging is useful for suppressing 'training' issues. Is this common in the 'English' training way of thinking? I thought it was simply to warm up a horse???

JBandRio · 10-16-2009, 07:28 AM

Lunging to suppress training issues is not unique to the English world

Taxi Jumper · 10-16-2009, 07:45 AM

What about feed? Is she on some type of 'high energy' feed like a sweet feed? I know horses (used to own one!) that went nutso on sweet feed! Heck when I got my mare she was on about 10.5 quarts of sweet feed a day! For a horse that was in a field doing nothing that was quite a bit, she was being fed the same as the racehorses at the barn :eek1: Hyper as anything. She trotted around the field for about 2 straight days when I put her out.

I waited until it was out of her system before I even attempted riding her.

So what is she being fed? Sometimes they end up with so much energy from feed that they don't know what to do with themselves.

JazzyJockey · 10-16-2009, 09:57 AM

i am feeding her grass/alfalfa . she also usually gets 1 cup of rice bran and one cup of BOSS. as for her excercise..she is turned out on a like 3 acre grassy field all day and is usually stalled at night unless the weather is nice enough to leave her out. Should i take her off the rice bran and BOSS...i didn't think it was making too much of a difference....and i suppose i could put her on just grass hay,too....i was also giving her sweet feed...but only about half a cup and only when she is stalled in the barn...so not even everyday. my dressage trainer said every horse should be lunged before riding because it isn't fair and can damage their muscles to just jump on and ride. ALL athletes (humans included) stretch and warm-up before work...so horses should too! i always lunge my horses to warm them up first.

i hope my post doesn't offend anyone.

10-15-2009, 03:48 PM	#35
Jumpergem Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: NorCal Posts: 304 Images: 3	Try turning her out before you ride, and let her play and get the energy out, and so she is a little tired then let her calm down. Then lunge her so she is a little calmer and a bit more tired, and really try and get her to just walk, alot! And if she is really good with that, you could ride her for abut 5-15 minutes and just have her walk. And make sure that you are calm as well, and not squeezing with your legs, and not tenseing up. __________________ I usually don't make that much sense, do I?

10-15-2009, 06:25 PM	#36
JBandRio Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: NC Posts: 32,004 Images: 196 Blog Entries: 12	Lunging to tire a horse out rarely ends up benefitting either party. It makes the horse more fit, which then means more lunging to get the energy level down, which makes the horse more fit, etc. It's not likely this is an energy issue. Yes, this horse may be a high energy horse, but that isn't the issue- the issue is mental relaxation so that training can begin. __________________ - JB Acres, owned and operated by Dynamite animals. - It's a wonder horses as a whole don't just kill us all and be done with their misery. - Keep your voice soothing and low - even when things get western (buck1173)

10-16-2009, 07:28 AM	#38
JBandRio Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: NC Posts: 32,004 Images: 196 Blog Entries: 12	Lunging to suppress training issues is not unique to the English world __________________ - JB Acres, owned and operated by Dynamite animals. - It's a wonder horses as a whole don't just kill us all and be done with their misery. - Keep your voice soothing and low - even when things get western (buck1173)

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10-15-2009, 07:14 AM	#32
JazzyJockey Banned Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Oregon Posts: 192 Images: 70	jbandrio that was directed toward jeep...don't get your feathers all ruffled. i wont ask for advice anymore,okay? so sorry to anyone offended by my short reply. i have already tried what was suggested (except for the bit) so i was really trying to get opinions on that. i said i was a "fine" rider. i didn't say i was excellent or the best or even "good". i mean i have been riding my whole life and am not an idiot on a horse. i think that makes sense,huh? anyways, i am done with this thread. just wanted to say i am sorry if i offended anyone...i didn't mean to. This horse had this problem from day one i got her which is what i have been trying to explain. it is the horses problem and why her old owners coudn't keep her. i have been working with her everday the weather permits and she is getting a little better. only because i am constantly holding her back,though. i think a bit change may be in order,but i will do more research on it. i think it is silly to automatically start saying that "oh..no...every horse problem is the riders the horse is never at fault for anything". that is obviously not true. her old owner was trying to have her husband ride her on trails and she kept bolting and he kept falling. and what was saying about the half-rearing...if she is trying to take off and i pull back on the reins and make her walk THAT is when she starts to the half-rears and snorting and trying to walk faster and faster. she hates to be held back at all and from what i know from her she either gets her rider off or gets her way. i just didn't want to give up on a horse most others have. anyways, so sorry. i won't waste my time or yours anymore.

10-15-2009, 09:25 AM	#34
jedy Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Ireland Posts: 1,533 Images: 48	How peculiar, really. I can't see what's so upsetting.

10-16-2009, 09:57 AM	#40
JazzyJockey Banned Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Oregon Posts: 192 Images: 70	i am feeding her grass/alfalfa . she also usually gets 1 cup of rice bran and one cup of BOSS. as for her excercise..she is turned out on a like 3 acre grassy field all day and is usually stalled at night unless the weather is nice enough to leave her out. Should i take her off the rice bran and BOSS...i didn't think it was making too much of a difference....and i suppose i could put her on just grass hay,too....i was also giving her sweet feed...but only about half a cup and only when she is stalled in the barn...so not even everyday. my dressage trainer said every horse should be lunged before riding because it isn't fair and can damage their muscles to just jump on and ride. ALL athletes (humans included) stretch and warm-up before work...so horses should too! i always lunge my horses to warm them up first. i hope my post doesn't offend anyone.