Flu and an Abcess all in one week!!!

clyde-gal · 05-07-2005, 01:55 PM

Buddy has had a virus all week long, along with many other horses at the ranch where I board him at. He now has an abcess where the throat latch normally is, it is about the size of a tennis ball and the surrounding hair is now almost all gone. Can anyone tell me about abcesses, the physiology (make up of it) and why it forms? This is the first time I have dealt with an abcess. (also our vet has given us antibiotics for when it splits open..)

Thanks!

RickB. · 05-08-2005, 12:04 AM

sounds to me as though your horse has strangles. And, since several others where you board are similarily sick, i'm more than a bit convinced that this is the case.

This is a highly contagious, infective illness and I am suprised your vet has not diagnosed it more accurately. All Horses at this location should be quarantined until , at a minimum, two weeks after the last ill horse has recovered. No horses in or out, and anyone coming on the property and in contact with the horses should thoroughly disinfect all their clothing and horse gear each and every time they leave the stable. They should also avoid visiting other horse operations since humans can carry the pathogens on their clothes, or anything else that has come in contact with the pathogens.

There is a rather long discussion right here on this forum about strangles that would be worth your time to read.

Rick

Craig · 05-08-2005, 06:39 AM

i think you need to take heed of rick's advice. it does sound like a possible case of strangles.

what tests has your vet done? did he/she give you any precautionary measures?

as rick said, strangles is a highly infectious disease. swollen glands/abscess in the throat latch area are classic signs, along with coughing, runny nose and lethargy (which can also be symptoms of a flu-like virus). if there is ANY suspicion at all that strangles is live on the yard, your vet should have given you some safety guidelines, namely the ones rick has mentioned.

there are many diseases that can be rapidly spread from one horse to another, by direct contact or via the air/enviroment. as clinical signs may not always be evident, it is good practice to take routine precautionary measures to reduce the risk of contracting or spreading the diseases. in the UK, any yard housing a horse suspected of having a live, highly contagious disease is "red taped", so no horses are allowed in and no horses allowed out. also people entering the yard must be warned as people carry such diseases from one horse to another.

good luck with your horse

Blistering Winds · 05-08-2005, 07:24 AM

Yes, that isn't the flu...that is FOR SURE, I bet you almost 100% it is strangles!!

Many of the symptoms LOOK like the flu before it abcesses. But once the throat abcesses, you know for sure you are dealing with strangles.

In my personal opinion, have the vet come out and drain the abcess. I see less scars with draining manually than if you wait for it to rupture, plus you remove the chance of it rupturing internally and killing your horse.

clyde-gal · 05-08-2005, 06:26 PM

Thanks guys, I think that you are 100% right. I looked up some info and after reading that and your inputs he shows the classic signs. This a.m. it started to burst open and drain, it is nasty- The vet hasn't seen him yet, his diagnosis was over the phone. Unfortunately there are a ton of horses around and the majority are all sick, but from what I can tell they don't have abcesses.

If there is any more information you have, I'd love it. I'd like to put some peroxide or something on it, any suggestions or no...? (peroxide is good for anaerobic bacteria)

Thanks again!

rainrider · 05-08-2005, 06:41 PM

I'm surprised your vet prescribed you antibiotics for strangles. Most vets do NOT as it can cause a case of "b.astard" strangles. "Antibiotics may be needed if the abscesses break but the animal is not showing signs of recovery, is still very ill, and not starting to eat." "After the abscesses break or are drained, the cavities should be swabbed out with strong (7%) tincture of iodine. Using three or four of the long cotton swabs together helps make the job a little more efficient and less unpleasant. You may want to cover your hand with a plastic bag of disposable glove to prevent tboth the pus and the iodine from running down it. Saturate the swabs in the iodine and work them around inside the opening of the abscess to clean out the pus and debris.

Make sure the hole stays open. If it scabs over, do not assume that it's healing ok. It should heal gradually from the inside out like other open wounds. You should be able to get the swabs in a little less each day. You should not be able to get them in an inch and a half one day and not get thim in at all the next. The object is to help the hol heal from the inside out. If you allow it to scab over before the infection isde is all cleaned out, it will only break open and drain again, prolonging the course of the disease. So, pick off the scab and keep swabbing!

Animals with an inadequate immune respone may develop a form of distemper(strangles) commonly called "b.astard strangles". This will only affect an individual animal, not the herd. Also, treatment of the animal with antibiotics, especially when used before the abgscesses break, may force the bacteria into the animal's internal organs, creating a case of b.astard strangles. This then necessitates very long-term antibiotic therapy." [i]Taken from "How To Be Your Own Veterinarian(sometimes).

RickB. · 05-09-2005, 10:45 AM

It would be best when handling any animal sick with strangles, to wear disposable gloves and booties and to discard them each and every time you leave the barn It is also wise to change into clean clothes each time, and to place the worn ones in a plastic bag and wash them and discard the bag as soon as you get home. I keep a strong anti-bacterial soap and liquid spray handy and will give myself the "once-over before I get into my vehicle.

And, if the horse blows any snot in the air around you or on you, thorough disinfecting is an absolute must.

You will have to be careful where you dispose of any bedding, and every horse's water bucket must be disinfected on a daily basis. No horse should drink out of a 'community' water tank, nor should a tank or bucket be filled with another one that might have been contaminated.

The good news is that once these horses go through the infection, they usually have a pretty good immune response in the future.

The b.astard strangles that were referred to by Rainrider, are an internal form of the disease and can be quite deadly.

Rick

05-07-2005, 01:55 PM	#1
clyde-gal Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: California Posts: 504 Images: 22	Flu and an Abcess all in one week!!! Buddy has had a virus all week long, along with many other horses at the ranch where I board him at. He now has an abcess where the throat latch normally is, it is about the size of a tennis ball and the surrounding hair is now almost all gone. Can anyone tell me about abcesses, the physiology (make up of it) and why it forms? This is the first time I have dealt with an abcess. (also our vet has given us antibiotics for when it splits open..) Thanks! __________________ Clyde-gal "Enjoy the little things in life, for one day you will look back and realize they were the big things." Unknown

05-08-2005, 12:04 AM	#2
RickB. Senior Member+ Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Champaign, Illinois Posts: 2,316	sounds to me as though your horse has strangles. And, since several others where you board are similarily sick, i'm more than a bit convinced that this is the case. This is a highly contagious, infective illness and I am suprised your vet has not diagnosed it more accurately. All Horses at this location should be quarantined until , at a minimum, two weeks after the last ill horse has recovered. No horses in or out, and anyone coming on the property and in contact with the horses should thoroughly disinfect all their clothing and horse gear each and every time they leave the stable. They should also avoid visiting other horse operations since humans can carry the pathogens on their clothes, or anything else that has come in contact with the pathogens. There is a rather long discussion right here on this forum about strangles that would be worth your time to read. Rick __________________ Rick Burten, CJF, CNBBT/F, RMF Je pense, donc je suis

05-08-2005, 06:39 AM	#3
Craig Senior Member+ Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Dublin, Ireland Posts: 272	i think you need to take heed of rick's advice. it does sound like a possible case of strangles. what tests has your vet done? did he/she give you any precautionary measures? as rick said, strangles is a highly infectious disease. swollen glands/abscess in the throat latch area are classic signs, along with coughing, runny nose and lethargy (which can also be symptoms of a flu-like virus). if there is ANY suspicion at all that strangles is live on the yard, your vet should have given you some safety guidelines, namely the ones rick has mentioned. there are many diseases that can be rapidly spread from one horse to another, by direct contact or via the air/enviroment. as clinical signs may not always be evident, it is good practice to take routine precautionary measures to reduce the risk of contracting or spreading the diseases. in the UK, any yard housing a horse suspected of having a live, highly contagious disease is "red taped", so no horses are allowed in and no horses allowed out. also people entering the yard must be warned as people carry such diseases from one horse to another. good luck with your horse __________________ Yesterday, I was a Vet! Today, I'm a Vet! Tomorrow, I'll probably still be a Vet! So little room for improvement! "GREEN BEER, LOTS OF CHEER, SLAINTE!"

05-08-2005, 07:24 AM	#4
Blistering Winds Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Augusta, Kansas Posts: 31,979 Images: 831 Blog Entries: 17	Yes, that isn't the flu...that is FOR SURE, I bet you almost 100% it is strangles!! Many of the symptoms LOOK like the flu before it abcesses. But once the throat abcesses, you know for sure you are dealing with strangles. In my personal opinion, have the vet come out and drain the abcess. I see less scars with draining manually than if you wait for it to rupture, plus you remove the chance of it rupturing internally and killing your horse. __________________ HGS is a very powerful, addicting place that is just as bad as cigarettes, however healthier for you AND your horse.

05-08-2005, 06:26 PM	#5
clyde-gal Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: California Posts: 504 Images: 22	Thanks guys, I think that you are 100% right. I looked up some info and after reading that and your inputs he shows the classic signs. This a.m. it started to burst open and drain, it is nasty- The vet hasn't seen him yet, his diagnosis was over the phone. Unfortunately there are a ton of horses around and the majority are all sick, but from what I can tell they don't have abcesses. If there is any more information you have, I'd love it. I'd like to put some peroxide or something on it, any suggestions or no...? (peroxide is good for anaerobic bacteria) Thanks again! __________________ Clyde-gal "Enjoy the little things in life, for one day you will look back and realize they were the big things." Unknown

05-08-2005, 06:41 PM	#6
rainrider Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 222	I'm surprised your vet prescribed you antibiotics for strangles. Most vets do NOT as it can cause a case of "b.astard" strangles. "Antibiotics may be needed if the abscesses break but the animal is not showing signs of recovery, is still very ill, and not starting to eat." "After the abscesses break or are drained, the cavities should be swabbed out with strong (7%) tincture of iodine. Using three or four of the long cotton swabs together helps make the job a little more efficient and less unpleasant. You may want to cover your hand with a plastic bag of disposable glove to prevent tboth the pus and the iodine from running down it. Saturate the swabs in the iodine and work them around inside the opening of the abscess to clean out the pus and debris. Make sure the hole stays open. If it scabs over, do not assume that it's healing ok. It should heal gradually from the inside out like other open wounds. You should be able to get the swabs in a little less each day. You should not be able to get them in an inch and a half one day and not get thim in at all the next. The object is to help the hol heal from the inside out. If you allow it to scab over before the infection isde is all cleaned out, it will only break open and drain again, prolonging the course of the disease. So, pick off the scab and keep swabbing! Animals with an inadequate immune respone may develop a form of distemper(strangles) commonly called "b.astard strangles". This will only affect an individual animal, not the herd. Also, treatment of the animal with antibiotics, especially when used before the abgscesses break, may force the bacteria into the animal's internal organs, creating a case of b.astard strangles. This then necessitates very long-term antibiotic therapy." [i]Taken from "How To Be Your Own Veterinarian(sometimes). Last edited by MissBandit; 05-09-2005 at 10:53 AM.

05-09-2005, 10:45 AM	#7
RickB. Senior Member+ Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Champaign, Illinois Posts: 2,316	It would be best when handling any animal sick with strangles, to wear disposable gloves and booties and to discard them each and every time you leave the barn It is also wise to change into clean clothes each time, and to place the worn ones in a plastic bag and wash them and discard the bag as soon as you get home. I keep a strong anti-bacterial soap and liquid spray handy and will give myself the "once-over before I get into my vehicle. And, if the horse blows any snot in the air around you or on you, thorough disinfecting is an absolute must. You will have to be careful where you dispose of any bedding, and every horse's water bucket must be disinfected on a daily basis. No horse should drink out of a 'community' water tank, nor should a tank or bucket be filled with another one that might have been contaminated. The good news is that once these horses go through the infection, they usually have a pretty good immune response in the future. The b.astard strangles that were referred to by Rainrider, are an internal form of the disease and can be quite deadly. Rick __________________ Rick Burten, CJF, CNBBT/F, RMF Je pense, donc je suis Last edited by MissBandit; 05-09-2005 at 10:53 AM.