[becrog]

I'm slightly confused by the English style classes members from the US discuss.

If I get anything wrong or mixed up here feel free to correct me and explain because like I said, Im all confused!

You talk about 'English' classes such as english pleasure and huntseat (are there more?) and Im interested as to what they involve; Over here we have general ridden and ridden/inhand hunter classes which Im guessing are the same as your EP and huntseat??? but then you also talk about hunter/jumper classes so what are they all about?

[MyBelgianAzzy]

"English" refers to the saddle style... english saddles and (depending on the show level) saddle seat as well.

The term "english pleasure" differentiates the riders from those riding "western pleasure".

The terms "huntseat" and "hunter under saddle" are primarily stock horse (QH, Paint) terms... when you see terms like that, it's most likely they want the level-headed, loose reined riding you see in western classes as well.

The majority of "english" riders (those in english tack) ride hunters and jumpers, with classes such as "Short Sturrip", "Pre-Childrens", "Modifieds"... which is simply in reference to the class level, fence height, and other restrictions, for example age.

[JKetsche]

I'm an event rider here in the US, and I get confused, too!

Hunter riders here are different from what you call hunters. A hunter here jumps a set course (consisting of some combination of outside lines and diagonal lines) for most stuff (correct me if I'm wrong, but medal stuff is different, right?). It can be in either an indoor or outdoor arena, and they are judged on rhythm, smoothness, gaits, form over fences, etc--for example, chipping in or getting a long spot can cost you a class. They incorporate flat classes as well, though I don't know a whole lot about it. They are permitted to school the course (which we eventers find bizarre) or have their coach on the sidelines talking them through it (which we find even weirder). It looks effortless--that's part of the point. There are eligibility rules, etc. so as MBA said, that's where the Baby-Pre-Green-Adult-Amatuer-Child-Short-Long-Stirrup stuff comes in. It's very popular for children.

Jumpers are basically like what you see in Grand Prix--jump clean, go to a jumpoff, jump clean and go faster than the other guy. There are subcategories (levels based on the height you are jumping, for example), but basically that's it. Many hunters never change to jumpers, while others "graduate" up to it. Many jumpers have some background in hunters, and shows are often run concurrently.

When it comes to HUS/huntseat, you're getting into the stockbreed stuff, and I know even less about that. Give me a cross country course any day--getting over the numbered jumps in order within the allotted time is easier!

That's about all I know, and I wouldn't quote me on any of that. Someone may correct me later. I have never really understood it all.

[Kiwi Pony]

Basically, the term 'English' is used to differentiate from Western riding

I hadn't heard of it too until I came on here! We refer to our disciplines by name e.g. dressage, SJ, showing, reining. It's up to you to know what saddle is used Though Western riding is called Western riding when spoken about in general.

I guess there's such a majority of 'English' (normal lol) riders that we never thought to give ourselves a group name? I guess maybe the Western riders have a name for us but if so I've never heard it.

[Kiwi Pony]

I think English pleasure is a flat class at a show.

We just say 'I'm going to a show/ribbon day/A&P/Easter Royal', and you enter a bunch of classes (I guess about 6 -8, e.g. turnout, paced & mannered, maiden hack, open hack, best family horse, best trot - whatever, depending on the level of the show) in your ring. You enter in the hack ring, not just one or two specific classes (generally).

Where as I THINK the classes in the states are more... independant? Like our 'rings', but on their own. And you might only enter a couple.

That's my impression anyway

[Huntseat]

English, in the most basic sense, is one of the general styles of riding. Saddleseat, dressage, jumping, and flat racing are all varied forms of "english riding", but within each of those disciplines are different divisions or classifications.

For example, in the Arab world (I dunno about other breeds), there are three saddleseat divisions - Country English Pleasure (Low amount of knee action, easygoing, well-mannered horse), English Pleasure (Higher, level knee action, more "firey"), and Park (Above level knee action, and even more "firey" usually). Hunter pleasure is also considered an English discipline, but unlike saddleseat, you use your standard "english" saddle and show the walk, trot, canter, and hand gallop on the rail on the flat.

In the open show or H/J (jumping) world, English Pleasure usually refers to a w/t/c flat rail class. That is also referred to as Hunter Under Saddle, as opposed to working hunter which is an over fences class.

Dressage is just... different, but still "english". Different (but similar) saddle, different riding style and attire, and it is a pattern class in which each horse/rider is scored on how they execute the moves set out in the pattern. They are given a percentage when all of the numbers are added up, and that is their score. Training Level is the most basic, while Fourth Level (I believe? Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not a dressage person) is one of the highest.

Eventing combines three "english" disciplines - Stadium, Cross country, and Dressage. Stadium jumping is a timed jumping course, XC is a timed (I believe?) "natural" jumping course with solid fences and natural obstacles, and, well, I already explained dressage.

Here is your typical, everyday "english" saddle. First thing that comes to most peoples' minds when you mention and english saddle. Of course, there are different types of these, too. Jumping, Close contact, and all purpose are just a few.


Dressage saddle:


Flat or Cutback saddle, used in saddleseat:


Darn, I should start writing textbooks! Haha, I have the tendency to ramble on..

[JKetsche]

Just to answer the question about timed XC, the course distance is measured and a pace is assigned by level (Novice would be 350-400 mpm--meters per minute--Training is 420-450 mpm, Preliminary is 520, Intermediate is 550, Advanced is 570). From that they calculate the "optimum time." For example, a 2000 m Novice course set at 400 mpm would have an optimum time of 5 minutes. You get penalized per second over optimum time, and if you go twice the optimum time (it takes you 10 minutes to get around) you are eliminated. For the lower levels, they will also penalize you for going too fast. They have the speed fault time (for this course it was 4:27), and if you come in faster than that you get penalized per second under speed fault time. The rationale is that part of cross country riding is an understanding of pace.

Our showjumping is also based on a wheeled distance and set speed (for example, Novice showjumping might be 320 mpm). You are penalized for going over the time allowed, though there is no speed fault time. Unlike in jumpers, it doesn't matter who has the fastest round.

[Huntseat]

Originally Posted by JKetsche

Just to answer the question about timed XC, the course distance is measured and a pace is assigned by level (Novice would be 350-400 mpm--meters per minute--Training is 420-450 mpm, Preliminary is 520, Intermediate is 550, Advanced is 570). From that they calculate the "optimum time." For example, a 2000 m Novice course set at 400 mpm would have an optimum time of 5 minutes. You get penalized per second over optimum time, and if you go twice the optimum time (it takes you 10 minutes to get around) you are eliminated. For the lower levels, they will also penalize you for going too fast. They have the speed fault time (for this course it was 4:27), and if you come in faster than that you get penalized per second under speed fault time. The rationale is that part of cross country riding is an understanding of pace.

Our showjumping is also based on a wheeled distance and set speed (for example, Novice showjumping might be 320 mpm). You are penalized for going over the time allowed, though there is no speed fault time. Unlike in jumpers, it doesn't matter who has the fastest round.

Thanks for clearing that up. I have a pretty good idea of the basics, but you get past that and I'm lost!

[LadysDreamin]

I benefited from that question, it really is complicated.