Color experts please. Color test info. back from UC Davis post 25

Slowrider · 04-04-2007, 08:50 AM

I have what I believe to be a smokey black AQHA mare that I bought from some people a couple of months ago. They say she isn't smokey black, but that she carries a dun gene.

Do any of you know if there is a test yet for the dun gene? I thought I had heard one time that UC Davis now has a test for the dun gene. Maybe I'm wrong, though.

Anyways, here are some pics. of my mare Luna. Notice the cream colored hair in her ears? And the pic. of her next to the grullo you can see some countershading on her back.

From what I know, her sire is a black and her dam was a chestnut. Here is a link to her pedigree:
Smokin Grullo Bar Quarter Horse

The previous owner claims she will throw grullos.

Okay color experts, give me your thoughts.

Thanks so much!

madvoice · 04-04-2007, 08:58 AM

Very interesting. I do like the countershading in her ears though. So cute

Shannon · 04-04-2007, 09:15 AM

No, no, no, and um, no

She'd have to be a grulla herself. Dun is always expressed, it can't be hidden. Dun + black (no agouti)= grulla.

However, she really does look to be smokey black with the light hair in her ears

. Just not sure where the Cr came from when looking at her pedigree!

JBandRio · 04-04-2007, 09:27 AM

If she's a grulla (dun on black) then she's the darkest one EVER!

I agree, she's likely a smokey black. That you CAN test for - you can determine if she carries the Creme gene, and if she's actually black.

Blistering Winds · 04-04-2007, 10:39 AM

Unless Lees Red Bever was creme....there is more chance that your horse is a Grulla.

3WishesDun · 04-04-2007, 10:50 AM

I followed a link from DunCentralStation to this stallion's page.
He is supposedly a dark grullo.
Mountain Village Farm - Stallion

Does your horse have any hint of a dorsal?

Slowrider · 04-04-2007, 11:19 AM

Yes, April. If you look at the one pic. of her standing next to the grullo you can see what I would have called countershading.

I have never seen a grullo horse that dark before though. And with the cream in the ears, I was positive that she is a smokey black.

I know she has some dun 3 or 4 generations back in her pedigree. She really has me stumped though. lol

The only thing I can think of is maybe her sire was really a smokey black and she inherited the cream gene. I know a lot of people make mistakes when registering their foals. I have a bay mare that is registered as a chestnut.

And her face markings are even wrong. But I know that is the right horse because I had her DNA typed. Her paperwork is being changed now.

I have pulled some mane hairs and will send them in for testing for the creme gene. I was just hoping that somebody would have come up with a test for the dun gene already too. I'm sure eventually they will have one.

Blistering Winds · 04-04-2007, 11:21 AM

There is no CREME on the sire side of the pedigree. Cannot inherit what is not there.

Though looking at the paper....what the heck is a "buckskin red dun?" Unless it was a dunalino....

(looking back, the "DUN" stops and starts again)

my AQHA membership is lapsed....so I can't go look on the actual site to see what they have them registered as.

Slowrider · 04-04-2007, 11:27 AM

Let me try to get a bigger pic. of the countershading.

http://www.horsegroomingsupplies.com...unaSilver3.JPG

Slowrider · 04-04-2007, 11:28 AM

It's there, but you can see it better in person of course. lol

Ya, I was wondering about the buckskin red dun too. lol

04-04-2007, 08:50 AM	#1
Slowrider Senior Member+ Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 1,989 Images: 116	Color experts please. Color test info. back from UC Davis post 25 I have what I believe to be a smokey black AQHA mare that I bought from some people a couple of months ago. They say she isn't smokey black, but that she carries a dun gene. Do any of you know if there is a test yet for the dun gene? I thought I had heard one time that UC Davis now has a test for the dun gene. Maybe I'm wrong, though. Anyways, here are some pics. of my mare Luna. Notice the cream colored hair in her ears? And the pic. of her next to the grullo you can see some countershading on her back. From what I know, her sire is a black and her dam was a chestnut. Here is a link to her pedigree: Smokin Grullo Bar Quarter Horse The previous owner claims she will throw grullos. Okay color experts, give me your thoughts. Thanks so much! Last edited by Slowrider; 04-16-2007 at 09:55 PM. Reason: New Information Added to title and last post.

04-04-2007, 08:58 AM	#2
madvoice Senior Member+ Join Date: May 2004 Location: Humpty Doo, Northern Territory, Australia Posts: 11,325 Images: 281	Very interesting. I do like the countershading in her ears though. So cute __________________ Sep 1997 - 15 Jan 2006 ~Fry Baby I'll Miss You~ I'm not a complete idiot.. Some parts are missing Owner of a lazy TB This is my shiny thing, and if you try and take it off me, I may have to eat you!

04-04-2007, 09:15 AM	#3
Shannon Senior Member+ Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: So Cal Posts: 10,831 Images: 1017 Blog Entries: 63	No, no, no, and um, no She'd have to be a grulla herself. Dun is always expressed, it can't be hidden. Dun + black (no agouti)= grulla. However, she really does look to be smokey black with the light hair in her ears . Just not sure where the Cr came from when looking at her pedigree! __________________ Mariah - 15 year old KWPN Dutch WB mare I ride earthquakes like I ride horses, often and with talent. And that's only ONE of my talents.

04-04-2007, 09:27 AM	#4
JBandRio Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: NC Posts: 32,000 Images: 196 Blog Entries: 12	If she's a grulla (dun on black) then she's the darkest one EVER! I agree, she's likely a smokey black. That you CAN test for - you can determine if she carries the Creme gene, and if she's actually black. __________________ - JB Acres, owned and operated by Dynamite animals. - It's a wonder horses as a whole don't just kill us all and be done with their misery. - Keep your voice soothing and low - even when things get western (buck1173)

04-04-2007, 10:39 AM	#5
Blistering Winds Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Augusta, Kansas Posts: 32,425 Images: 864 Blog Entries: 18	Unless Lees Red Bever was creme....there is more chance that your horse is a Grulla. __________________ Can I have a midlife crisis now?

04-04-2007, 10:50 AM	#6
3WishesDun Senior Moderator Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: At My Wit's End Posts: 17,689 Images: 659 Blog Entries: 27	I followed a link from DunCentralStation to this stallion's page. He is supposedly a dark grullo. Mountain Village Farm - Stallion Does your horse have any hint of a dorsal? __________________ Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change. The woods are lovely, dark and deep, But I have promises to keep, And miles to go before I sleep. -Frost I've Been Snowballed!

04-04-2007, 11:19 AM	#7
Slowrider Senior Member+ Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 1,989 Images: 116	Yes, April. If you look at the one pic. of her standing next to the grullo you can see what I would have called countershading. I have never seen a grullo horse that dark before though. And with the cream in the ears, I was positive that she is a smokey black. I know she has some dun 3 or 4 generations back in her pedigree. She really has me stumped though. lol The only thing I can think of is maybe her sire was really a smokey black and she inherited the cream gene. I know a lot of people make mistakes when registering their foals. I have a bay mare that is registered as a chestnut. And her face markings are even wrong. But I know that is the right horse because I had her DNA typed. Her paperwork is being changed now. I have pulled some mane hairs and will send them in for testing for the creme gene. I was just hoping that somebody would have come up with a test for the dun gene already too. I'm sure eventually they will have one.

04-04-2007, 11:21 AM	#8
Blistering Winds Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Augusta, Kansas Posts: 32,425 Images: 864 Blog Entries: 18	There is no CREME on the sire side of the pedigree. Cannot inherit what is not there. Though looking at the paper....what the heck is a "buckskin red dun?" Unless it was a dunalino.... (looking back, the "DUN" stops and starts again) my AQHA membership is lapsed....so I can't go look on the actual site to see what they have them registered as. __________________ Can I have a midlife crisis now?

04-04-2007, 11:27 AM	#9
Slowrider Senior Member+ Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 1,989 Images: 116	Let me try to get a bigger pic. of the countershading. http://www.horsegroomingsupplies.com...unaSilver3.JPG

04-04-2007, 11:28 AM	#10
Slowrider Senior Member+ Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 1,989 Images: 116	It's there, but you can see it better in person of course. lol Ya, I was wondering about the buckskin red dun too. lol

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Color experts please. ***Color test info. back from UC Davis*** post 25

Color experts please. Color test info. back from UC Davis post 25