Color Experts HELP!!!

Appylvr · 10-04-2005, 05:21 PM

I have a quick question...

Can a BUCKSKIN stallion pass on both his creme gene and his bay gene? Making a Buckskin foal? I was under the impression that horses can only pass on one gene, so it would have to be one or the other. But someone was trying to tell me today that they are different so they can pass on both. I was just wondering what you guys think?

I was telling her that I had no chance of getting a Buckskin from the breeding I did (I was so anxious for a Buckskin!!!) I bred my chestnut QH mare to a loud Buckskin Overo Paint stud and got a BS Palomino.

Which I believe is because my mare couldn't pass on a gene right? Because chestnut is recessive. So the stud passed on his creme gene, not his bay gene, making the foal come out Palomino.

Am I thinking on the right track?

Bubba · 10-05-2005, 07:54 AM

No, your friend had it right

. Since the two genes ("bay" and "cream") are at different physical locations on the DNA strand, they can both be passed on together.

Think of it this way; chestnut or black depend on the same gene (E or e). Bay or not depends on a different gene (A or a). Cream or not depends on a third gene (C or c). When momma and daddy's genes combine, they pick one from each *at each specific location* to form a complete DNA strand. So you can only have two forms of each gene, but each of those genes has a different location. Kind of like roommates in college....two per room, but there's lots of rooms

.

Does that help?

Oh, as an aside, bred to a buckskin, your chestnut mare *can* have a buckskin baby

.

Heavenly Jumper · 10-05-2005, 08:09 AM

Learn something every day!

Madick · 10-28-2005, 03:57 AM

Genetics is a jungle! You have the basic colors, chestnut, bay/brown and black. All horses has that as a ground. Any modifications are other genes.

Grey horses are born another color, so a horse either has a grey-gene or a nongrey-gene to pass on. Same with buckskins and palominos. They are brown/chestnut with a creme-gene. So they pass on cream or no-cream.

Horsecoloring is a lot of fun, but a lot to keep track on!

JBandRio · 10-28-2005, 05:27 AM

Actually, the base colors are chestnut (red, which is actually not-black) and black. That's it.

Everything else is a modification or a coverup.

Black is dominant over every other color. Gray is not a color, it's a coverup and is dominant over everything.

Red is recessive, so it takes 2 reds to make a chestnut.

Bay is dominant, but only affects black hairs, so bay with black WILL make a bay horse, but bay with chestnut hides, as there are no black hairs to modify.

Since black is dominant, a black or bay horse can also carry a red gene. If they carry 2 black genes they are homozygous for black and can never produce a chestnut foal.

Buckskin is a bay with a single dilute.
Palomino is a chestnut with a single dilute.
Smokey black is a black with a single dilute
Perlin is a bay with 2 dilute
Cremello is a chestnut with 2 dilutes
Smokey cream is a black with 2 dilutes.

10-04-2005, 05:21 PM	#1
Appylvr Senior Member+ Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: California Posts: 6,954 Images: 307	Color Experts HELP!!! I have a quick question... Can a BUCKSKIN stallion pass on both his creme gene and his bay gene? Making a Buckskin foal? I was under the impression that horses can only pass on one gene, so it would have to be one or the other. But someone was trying to tell me today that they are different so they can pass on both. I was just wondering what you guys think? I was telling her that I had no chance of getting a Buckskin from the breeding I did (I was so anxious for a Buckskin!!!) I bred my chestnut QH mare to a loud Buckskin Overo Paint stud and got a BS Palomino. Which I believe is because my mare couldn't pass on a gene right? Because chestnut is recessive. So the stud passed on his creme gene, not his bay gene, making the foal come out Palomino. Am I thinking on the right track?

10-05-2005, 08:09 AM	#3
Heavenly Jumper Senior Member+ Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Camden County GA Posts: 14,728 Images: 1303 Blog Entries: 243	Learn something every day! __________________ My husband is away...if I am crabby, whiney or generally unpleasant, I apologize. Being a Navy wife is the hardest thing I've ever done...and I do it for you. .'~'. epi tan e epi tas .'~'.

10-28-2005, 05:27 AM	#5
JBandRio Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: NC Posts: 21,644 Images: 132 Blog Entries: 12	Actually, the base colors are chestnut (red, which is actually not-black) and black. That's it. Everything else is a modification or a coverup. Black is dominant over every other color. Gray is not a color, it's a coverup and is dominant over everything. Red is recessive, so it takes 2 reds to make a chestnut. Bay is dominant, but only affects black hairs, so bay with black WILL make a bay horse, but bay with chestnut hides, as there are no black hairs to modify. Since black is dominant, a black or bay horse can also carry a red gene. If they carry 2 black genes they are homozygous for black and can never produce a chestnut foal. Buckskin is a bay with a single dilute. Palomino is a chestnut with a single dilute. Smokey black is a black with a single dilute Perlin is a bay with 2 dilute Cremello is a chestnut with 2 dilutes Smokey cream is a black with 2 dilutes. __________________ - JB Acres, owned and operated by Dynamite animals. - It's a wonder horses as a whole don't just kill us all and be done with their misery. - Keep your voice soothing and low - even when things get western (buck1173) - Rio feels good - he bounced an in-and-out

10-05-2005, 07:54 AM	#2
Bubba Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 318	No, your friend had it right . Since the two genes ("bay" and "cream") are at different physical locations on the DNA strand, they can both be passed on together. Think of it this way; chestnut or black depend on the same gene (E or e). Bay or not depends on a different gene (A or a). Cream or not depends on a third gene (C or c). When momma and daddy's genes combine, they pick one from each at each specific location to form a complete DNA strand. So you can only have two forms of each gene, but each of those genes has a different location. Kind of like roommates in college....two per room, but there's lots of rooms . Does that help? Oh, as an aside, bred to a buckskin, your chestnut mare can have a buckskin baby .

10-28-2005, 03:57 AM	#4
Madick Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Abq, NM / Sweden Posts: 697 Images: 37	Genetics is a jungle! You have the basic colors, chestnut, bay/brown and black. All horses has that as a ground. Any modifications are other genes. Grey horses are born another color, so a horse either has a grey-gene or a nongrey-gene to pass on. Same with buckskins and palominos. They are brown/chestnut with a creme-gene. So they pass on cream or no-cream. Horsecoloring is a lot of fun, but a lot to keep track on!