[kodemiester]

How do you get a horse to start collecting? I've had videos up on here of Dakoda, back in August I believe, and the old thread, said she needs to learn to collect before I can/should start making her go slow. lol. I've gotten her to stop on "whoa" right when I say it. It still shocks me. lol. I don't have any current videos of her.. but ya. lol. Is there anything else I need to work on her with those? Please Tell me HOW I can work on her with the things she needs to work on if you say something. lol. I have a round pen, and a flat area to work in.. no arena. There's one of the vids if that helps.
Thanks!! Any tips to get her to get her head to come down, with out draw reins? o.o

YouTube - Dakoda and I Random Pattern 2

[raisethebar]

Review this; regardless of your discipline it's necessary for productive, correct riding.

[Jumpergem]

I asked my trainer about that a while ago, and she talked about the Pyramid of Training, and we worked on that, and within an hour, he started collecting! so that is a great thing to work on.

[raisethebar]

Originally Posted by Jumpergem

I asked my trainer about that a while ago, and she talked about the Pyramid of Training, and we worked on that, and within an hour, he started collecting! so that is a great thing to work on.

When schooling or training clients horses from the start, as well as my own mare I use it, of course with my own little changes. On an unfinished horse such as this one, it should take quite a while to complete as any other training. This mare obviously has the basics, but I see plenty of "holes to fill", and I think this pyramid would really help It's a great guide line.

[Rhythm 'n Blues]

Yup the pyramid is great. I have to say that the horse in the video isn't not in rhythm relaxed, connected, have impulsion or is straight.

There isn't a 100% tempo to his gaits, not that I could see anyways, and while he may seem quiet, he's not relaxed. He really needs to drive from behind, into a giving & elastic hand who is always THERE -- all of those things aren't happening from the video. It just appears that he is being ridden "leg means go, hand means stop" and there isn't any sort of finness or fine tuning in between. These things need to come before anything further can acutally occur.

As for how to do this -- there have been many many books written on this, so it would take a life time to explain. Try looking into PiaffePony's thread about "sitting the trot" It gives great info on the kind of trot you'll need. Then doing a search about "collection", "head set", "on the bit", "impulsion", "forward", etc will all yeild great results that will point you at least in the right direction.

[John]

Originally Posted by raisethebar

Review this; regardless of your discipline it's necessary for productive, correct riding.

This is the old standard but is there another way? How would a trainer do it if he was starting a long yearling as a futurity prospect? While I don't agree with starting a horse that young it is done all the time. What we can learn from this practice is how they keep from damaging the back of the young horse ? It is by teaching collection before they climb on for the first time. It is not the finished collection that is talked about using the above chart but it is far easier on a horse of any age to start this way. JMHO

[Gutter_Doll]

I'll update this post when I've finished this assignment on a bigger 'scheme', but from that short video, the amount of pressure you've got on the reins there should have him backing off your hands. Thats collection. Backing off your hands and moving forward off your legs. A good go button and a good stop button.

[kodemiester]

lol. Thanks for all the help every one. =]

[MuckMuck]

Originally Posted by John

This is the old standard but is there another way? How would a trainer do it if he was starting a long yearling as a futurity prospect? While I don't agree with starting a horse that young it is done all the time. What we can learn from this practice is how they keep from damaging the back of the young horse ? It is by teaching collection before they climb on for the first time. It is not the finished collection that is talked about using the above chart but it is far easier on a horse of any age to start this way. JMHO

In the reining /Western world the above pyramid could apply,but there are a few more steps that would more than likely come under the relaxation and connection blocks.

We bend the horse and really get a nice quiet lateral flex SOLID on the horse first and then start to bring in the vertical flexion just a little at a time.
We just kind of sneak it in here and there at certain points of the training and it gradually increases,but it all starts with the lateral flex.
Impulsion is always stressed and straightness is VERY important as young horses are usually asked to accomplish basic maneuvers in a straight line and then built up to the circle at all the gates.
More balance and control is required in the circle and to collect in the circle takes a bit more effort and learning.

[John]

Originally Posted by MuckMuck

In the reining /Western world the above pyramid could apply,but there are a few more steps that would more than likely come under the relaxation and connection blocks.

We bend the horse and really get a nice quiet lateral flex SOLID on the horse first and then start to bring in the vertical flexion just a little at a time.
We just kind of sneak it in here and there at certain points of the training and it gradually increases,but it all starts with the lateral flex.
Impulsion is always stressed and straightness is VERY important as young horses are usually asked to accomplish basic maneuvers in a straight line and then built up to the circle at all the gates.
More balance and control is required in the circle and to collect in the circle takes a bit more effort and learning.

This mare could do nice quiet flying lead changes after one week of riding. This is my daughter up.

She was about four years old when she was started. As reiners are expected to do most maneuvers on a slack rein driving them up into the bit first and then trying to change all of that would take a lot of effort to just get back to where you started. I know I have done it many times. By working on basic collection first the horse is packing the rider comfortably from the first ride on and all of the other maneuvers fall into place much faster.