Blue Seal feed

MsPatricia · 08-08-2008, 07:42 AM

I have always used Blue Seal and have had no problems with it. I have also called Blue Seal directly to find out who the local representative is and got her phone number and email - she has been very helpful in finding the right combonation of feed and supplements for my horse without hard sales on anything. Just a thought.

harli36 · 08-08-2008, 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dawn

The Hunter is closest to Strategy in terms of nutrition and purpose. But it's definately not something I would recommend feeding.

The Carb-Guard (designed to be fed at high levels) and Min-a-Vite Lite (low feeding level) are the only two formulations that I would consider based on what I see from their website.

Just curious as to why Hunter is definitely not something you would feed and why you say that carb guard is designed to be fed at high levels?

Dawn · 08-08-2008, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by harli36

Just curious as to why Hunter is definitely not something you would feed and why you say that carb guard is designed to be fed at high levels?

The hunter is very heavily corn based, and designed to be fed in the higher range. Just not safe or healthy. (I could likely go more in depth, but I'm going off memory of what I read yesterday here.)

The carb guard, I was going by their feeding directions listed on their website.

harli36 · 08-08-2008, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dawn

The hunter is very heavily corn based, and designed to be fed in the higher range. Just not safe or healthy. (I could likely go more in depth, but I'm going off memory of what I read yesterday here.)

The carb guard, I was going by their feeding directions listed on their website.

It does have more corn in it then I like as well. But I've not been impressed with Purina products and around here it's either blue seal or Triple crown. I know alot of horses on Blue seal who look, act and perform great on it.

Carb guard seems pretty low in their feeding to me. It's only 2.5 lbs for a 1000 horse at maintenance. I've commonly seen much higher. Although I will admit I often don't follow manufactures feeding instructions, so it's been awhile since I've really paid attention to it. I do all the calculations, taking hay and min/vit. supplement into consideration and feed based on that.

Dawn · 08-08-2008, 06:35 PM

The minimum for maintenance is pretty low. But look at the range it provides. You have a 5 lb variable there. That means that the lower end of that spectrum is going to be negligable as far as nutrition is concerned. Otherwise, the higher end wouldn't be safe/appropriate to feed.

Overall, it's not really a 'high' amount, but it does fall into the higher amount (imo). It would contribute a reasonably significant amount of calories to the overall diet.

Huntseat · 08-09-2008, 04:24 PM

Thanks everybody, very useful information here

Quote:

Originally Posted by harli36

You've got Morgan's right huntseat?

They can be prone to IR. In general it's better for horses to be on low carb higher fat diets, especially horses who may be more prone to IR.

I personally feed the Carb Guard feed which is a low carb higher fat feed. It also has a lower protein level though(11%) . Depending on how much work your horses are doing you may want to feed "Hunter" which has a higher protein and a higher fat lower carb feed.

I have Arabs, but you were close

I try to work my horses at least 5 days a week and it is usually a pretty hard workout, a solid 45 minutes of work with a fifteen minut warmup and cool down.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dawn

The Hunter is closest to Strategy in terms of nutrition and purpose. But it's definately not something I would recommend feeding.

The Carb-Guard (designed to be fed at high levels) and Min-a-Vite Lite (low feeding level) are the only two formulations that I would consider based on what I see from their website.

Please forgive my ignorance, but can you please define what you mean by high and low levels? Do you mean levels of work and exercise or amount of feed or the nutrition in the feeds? Thank you

Also, once again I am showing my ignorance about equine nutrition, but why would you stay away from feed with a lot of corn? I know that it is supposed to make horses hot, but that isn't really a concern of mine. Is there more to it than that?

Dawn · 08-10-2008, 06:14 AM

Corn has a lot of things going against it.

It's very high in sugars/starches (~65% off of a source I pulled up just to check). Now, the Hunter formulation is of course not going to be nearly that high in NSC overall as it's not pure corn, but that corn, even at a moderate inclusion level is going to really push the total NSC up.

Corn is a prime breeding ground for aflatoxins. (You might remember some of the recent recalls. Started with Purina, but included several other companies as well.)

Then you have the general issues with high grain diets. Because corn is so high in NSC, it's even worse lb for lb than some other grains that are lower. Behavior issues, GI issues (ulcers, etc...), laminitis/founder, increased risk of developing metabolic issues, immune system suppression, etc...

Having said all that, it would be interesting to know what the NSC of Hunter is. But even if it is relatively low (at best it would fall into the 'moderate' category I'd bet), I still wouldn't recommend or feed it due to the higher risks of corn than other grains.

As far as the 'levels' I referred to, I was talking about feeding levels. The Carb-Guard is designed to be a source of nutrition and calories. The Min-a-Vite Lite is designed to be a source of nutrition with minimal calories. For the hypothetical 1000 lb adult in light work, you would feed approximately 2/3-1 lb of Min-a-Vite as opposed to the 5-10 lbs of Carb Guard you would feed.

Which brings up the other issue I touched on. The Carb Guard has a relatively wide feeding range. This means that the lower end of the feeding range is going to supply a lot less nutrition than the upper range. This allows it to be fed to a wider variety of horses, but will by default shortchange some of them on the nutritional package it delivers.

Some horses in light work (though certainly not all or probably even most) would require more calories than the Min-a-Vite and hay/pasture would provide. This can be provided through sources like beet pulp or alfalfa pellets (forage sources) or rice bran or BOSS (fat sources). There are other alternatives as well. But those four are a good base to choose from depending upon the horse's specific needs. This provides well balanced nutrition with safe and useable sources of supplemental calories.

How much Strategy are they currently getting?

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08-08-2008, 07:42 AM	#11
MsPatricia Full Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Westfield, MA Posts: 90	I have always used Blue Seal and have had no problems with it. I have also called Blue Seal directly to find out who the local representative is and got her phone number and email - she has been very helpful in finding the right combonation of feed and supplements for my horse without hard sales on anything. Just a thought.

08-08-2008, 06:35 PM	#15
Dawn Senior Member+ Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Tennessee Posts: 29,631 Images: 1283	The minimum for maintenance is pretty low. But look at the range it provides. You have a 5 lb variable there. That means that the lower end of that spectrum is going to be negligable as far as nutrition is concerned. Otherwise, the higher end wouldn't be safe/appropriate to feed. Overall, it's not really a 'high' amount, but it does fall into the higher amount (imo). It would contribute a reasonably significant amount of calories to the overall diet.

08-10-2008, 06:14 AM	#17
Dawn Senior Member+ Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Tennessee Posts: 29,631 Images: 1283	Corn has a lot of things going against it. It's very high in sugars/starches (~65% off of a source I pulled up just to check). Now, the Hunter formulation is of course not going to be nearly that high in NSC overall as it's not pure corn, but that corn, even at a moderate inclusion level is going to really push the total NSC up. Corn is a prime breeding ground for aflatoxins. (You might remember some of the recent recalls. Started with Purina, but included several other companies as well.) Then you have the general issues with high grain diets. Because corn is so high in NSC, it's even worse lb for lb than some other grains that are lower. Behavior issues, GI issues (ulcers, etc...), laminitis/founder, increased risk of developing metabolic issues, immune system suppression, etc... Having said all that, it would be interesting to know what the NSC of Hunter is. But even if it is relatively low (at best it would fall into the 'moderate' category I'd bet), I still wouldn't recommend or feed it due to the higher risks of corn than other grains. As far as the 'levels' I referred to, I was talking about feeding levels. The Carb-Guard is designed to be a source of nutrition and calories. The Min-a-Vite Lite is designed to be a source of nutrition with minimal calories. For the hypothetical 1000 lb adult in light work, you would feed approximately 2/3-1 lb of Min-a-Vite as opposed to the 5-10 lbs of Carb Guard you would feed. Which brings up the other issue I touched on. The Carb Guard has a relatively wide feeding range. This means that the lower end of the feeding range is going to supply a lot less nutrition than the upper range. This allows it to be fed to a wider variety of horses, but will by default shortchange some of them on the nutritional package it delivers. Some horses in light work (though certainly not all or probably even most) would require more calories than the Min-a-Vite and hay/pasture would provide. This can be provided through sources like beet pulp or alfalfa pellets (forage sources) or rice bran or BOSS (fat sources). There are other alternatives as well. But those four are a good base to choose from depending upon the horse's specific needs. This provides well balanced nutrition with safe and useable sources of supplemental calories. How much Strategy are they currently getting?