[bugsys22575]

Originally Posted by HorseGeek

Black horses can appear brown and brown horses can appear black to even a trained eye.As I said somewhere else - No ones eyes are a DNA probe - .Check the agouti statis if you are interested in the horse. Discuss the horse with the owner instead of the on line self professed color experts.

And from the other thread:

Originally Posted by HorseGeek

Most true black horses are a bit faded somewhere.The ONLY accurate why to determine if a horse is truly black is to check his agouti statis.I think it's inappropriate to guess about someone else's horses on line.It would be best to contact the owner and ask if he's been DNA tested. If he hasn't been tested and you are interested in purchasing him you should offer to pay for the test - it is only $25. No one's eyes are a DNA probe .This forum is bad about discussing other people's horses as if we are the experts instead of discussing this with the horse's owner.

I read your other comment on the other thread as well, and I just have to ask...

Who ****** in your Wheaties this morning?

I find these topics VERY informative. I learn A LOT from them. And I respect each of their opinions.

If everyone went staright to the owner (breeding), or the vet (health), or the BNT(training), or the professionals (all others), there would not be as much of an opportunity for us to learn on this board. The PURPOSE of these discussions is to learn. Not to gossip, bash, humiliate, or slandarize anyone or their horses.

AND chances are, you could call up the owner, vet, BNT, and/or professional, and still be left in the dark on the topic you were inquiring upon because a) they dont know themselves, b)they dont care to talk to you, c)they dont have the time to answer COUNTLESS questions some of us have on the subject. Also, when doing so, when discussing many of these topics, you get ONE opinion. On this board, many opinions come into play, allowing us "students" to gather from the best and make our own decisions and form our own opinions, based on the knowledge that was provided.

I absolutely LOVE this board. It's like being back in Horse Science, but the discussions never end, and I can come and go as I please. (And I seem to pay attention more here.)

Now, forgive me for being rude. If you dont like the way things are done around here, please leave and let the rest of us have a chance to learn without the disruption in our classroom. No one is forcing you to read. No one is twisting your arm to be here. With all due respect, if you dont like it, LEAVE.

[FeatheredFeet]

Quote:
Incidentally, we have seen one test returned as EE from a popular testing company, when we absolutely knew he was not.
Did you call for a re-check on that? I have a friend who tested a filly for Pearl, and the test came back that she was. Turned out they'd mis-typed the results

The stallion with the incorrect test results, did not belong to us, but yes, the owner insisted he was Ea as we all knew and indeed they did retest him with that result.

Most of us in Gyspies, do test for black, red and agouti. Silver, pearl, cream etc., if we suspect it. Some test for sabino1, but not all of us. One of the surprising things we've found, is that many tobianos which appear heterozygous, turn out to be homozygous, even with no paw prints. In the early days of the breed in the US, most wanted homozygous for black and tobiano. That has changed over the years and the odd colours are becoming more popular. Lots of black and bay silver these days, pearl, palomino and others are becoming popular.

[*Foxy*Hunter*]

Originally Posted by bugsys22575

I find these topics VERY informative. I learn A LOT from them. And I respect each of their opinions.

If everyone went staright to the owner (breeding), or the vet (health), or the BNT(training), or the professionals (all others), there would not be as much of an opportunity for us to learn on this board. The PURPOSE of these discussions is to learn. Not to gossip, bash, humiliate, or slandarize anyone or their horses.

AND chances are, you could call up the owner, vet, BNT, and/or professional, and still be left in the dark on the topic you were inquiring upon because a) they dont know themselves, b)they dont care to talk to you, c)they dont have the time to answer COUNTLESS questions some of us have on the subject. Also, when doing so, when discussing many of these topics, you get ONE opinion. On this board, many opinions come into play, allowing us "students" to gather from the best and make our own decisions and form our own opinions, based on the knowledge that was provided.

I absolutely LOVE this board. It's like being back in Horse Science, but the discussions never end, and I can come and go as I please. (And I seem to pay attention more here.)

Now, forgive me for being rude. If you dont like the way things are done around here, please leave and let the rest of us have a chance to learn without the disruption in our classroom. No one is forcing you to read. No one is twisting your arm to be here. With all due respect, if you dont like it, LEAVE.

Equine genetics is so confusing, but without this board there are very few things I would know/understand.

Most people on here are your average horse owner who want to learn more. No-one is going to force you into joining in on a disscussion. If you don't like the topic that is being disscussed, pass the thread by.

As for the self-professed color experts: If it wasn't for them, many of the people on this forum would be in the dark about equine gentics. And I thank them for their efforts (wether the answer is right or wrong ).

[HorseGeek]

DNA is still better than guessing- just a fact -- being accurate is as important as being informative don't you think? TEST TEST TEST===== observations backed by DNA will teach you more faster.

[JBandRio]

obviously a test is better.

But when someone says "guess", well...

[Capilet]

I see a black with sweat-fade, personally. A fellow boarder at a past farm had a VERY black Perch gelding that had major sweat fade on his back, as well as that low flank area.

Originally Posted by HorseGeek

DNA is still better than guessing- just a fact -- being accurate is as important as being informative don't you think? TEST TEST TEST===== observations backed by DNA will teach you more faster.

Every test that proves color, dna, etc was once a guess.

Hypotheses and exploration are at the root of science, without them, we wouldn't have the tests.

I too, am happy to learn about color from these threads.

[RiddleMeThis]

Originally Posted by bugsys22575

Now, forgive me for being rude. If you dont like the way things are done around here, please leave and let the rest of us have a chance to learn without the disruption in our classroom. No one is forcing you to read. No one is twisting your arm to be here. With all due respect, if you dont like it, LEAVE.

Agreed. Go play in your own sandbox if you do not like this one.

And I personally think there is TONS to learn from these discussions. You can look at these girls test results all day and still think W.T.F. is going on?

And really, how much time do you think a stallion owner is going to waste on people calling who have no interest in breeding to their stallion and just want to ask if the horse is really brown or black? Why bother a hard working SO when you are just wasting their time, when you can post on here and get some REALLY knowledgeable answers, including possibly someone who actually KNOWS the stud.

I think it was on this thread or another thread, but there were about 5 people asking for a stallions color test results. Thats five people calling a busy stallion owner when I already know the answer because I HAVE asked. Why bother the SO six times instead of just once?

[Shannon]

Originally Posted by HorseGeek

DNA is still better than guessing- just a fact -- being accurate is as important as being informative don't you think? TEST TEST TEST===== observations backed by DNA will teach you more faster.

Sure, if you wanna pay for the DNA test(s) So many of these stallion/mare owners just don't CARE what color there horse is.

You know what though, you CAN post a pedigree and have someone decipher the genetics WITHOUT testing. Not always, but sometimes. My mare is obviously brown, and tested to be EE. We KNOW she is Ata without testing because her father was an obvious bay and who had produced blacks. Therefore we know he was Aa, and thus she had to have gotten the At from her bay dam (who must have been AAt) and the a from her Aa sire.

Someone who doesn't know enough to put that together can still post "What color is my horse?" threads and learn...Without testing

[ACCphotography]

Even if you offered to pay, some SOs simply won't take the time to deal with you, pull the hair and get it done. Believe me, I've tried.

[the travlng rdr]

Originally Posted by HorseGeek

observations backed by DNA will teach you more faster.

Are we missing a comma or did we just graduate from RNU?