Appaloosa color/pattern help needed!

bnwalker2 · 11-02-2009, 04:58 AM

I'm helping a neighbor sell this horse, and I have NO idea what color to say she is, LOL. Parents aren't known. She is 4 years old.

I can go get more detailed pictures if needed.

FarFromOver · 11-02-2009, 05:49 AM

No idea but she's neat looking!

bnwalker2 · 11-02-2009, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FarFromOver

No idea but she's neat looking!

I know! I saw her from the side and thought chestnut maybe... but then I saw her tail, and then saw her from the side her mane was on and got confused

Eastowest · 11-02-2009, 06:32 AM

I would say snowflake roan as far as pattern.... chestnut is the closest as far as what her base color LOOKS like to the average observer-- but I would be curious how she tests for E and A because as has been discussed here, the LP gene can mess around with the appearance of base colors, including causing a really "faded" look to black pigment.. and the dark chocolate on her legs, mane roots, and the goldness around her muzzle and eyes make me wonder if she really might be bay or brown.... but calling her that in an ad would just confuse people! LOL

Laura Lyon
Eastowest
http://www.eastowest.com

ACCphotography · 11-02-2009, 09:45 AM

Seal brown snowflake with varnish IMO.

Eastowest · 11-02-2009, 12:21 PM

This is not directed at you ACC, as I am seeing more people on discussion lists using the term the way you do, and it seems to be becoming "standard usage" (especially among non-Appaloosa people)--but this seems like as good an opportunity as any to say that, as a long-time Appaloosa owner/breeder/enthusiast, I dislike using the term "varnish roan" for any and all expressions of appaloosa/LP roaning.

To me, thats what roaning seen on an Appaloosa is-- LP roan, or appaloosa roan. A "varnish" roan is called that for a specific reason--the LP roaning has progressed to the point and in a manner that "varnishing" is apparent--- ie, the roaning has "left out" darker areas. (Particularly on the bony prominences of the horse's body.) Like this.

NOT all LP- roaning horses roan enough/in a manner which shows "varnishing"-- and unless/until they do, I am not gonna call them "varnish roans".

There. I feel better now.

Laura Lyon
Eastowest
http://www.eastowest.com

ACCphotography · 11-02-2009, 12:28 PM

So you're saying varnish is merely a STAGE of LP roaning as opposed to the name of LP roaning itself? Just making sure I understand you.

Eastowest · 11-02-2009, 12:37 PM

I see "varnish roan" like I see "snowflake roan"-- as a description of what the LP-roaning coat looks like on whatever particular horse at that time. Some LP roans never develop snowflakes, some LP roans never develop varnishing. Varnishing might be considered a "stage", yes, because if an LP roan horse roans "enough", it is most likely to appear varnished-- however there are Appaloosas that live a long life as LP roans that never show that stage of roaning.

Laura Lyon
Eastowest
http://www.eastowest.com

Fancy That · 11-03-2009, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eastowest

I see "varnish roan" like I see "snowflake roan"-- as a description of what the LP-roaning coat looks like on whatever particular horse at that time. Some LP roans never develop snowflakes, some LP roans never develop varnishing. Varnishing might be considered a "stage", yes, because if an LP roan horse roans "enough", it is most likely to appear varnished-- however there are Appaloosas that live a long life as LP roans that never show that stage of roaning.

Laura Lyon
Eastowest
http://www.eastowest.com

This is why I love this forum! You learn something new all the time! Laura - it totally makes sense to stick to the genetic color "LP Roan or LP Roaning" and save the descriptives for whatever is applicable (varnish, snowflake, etc)

Personally, I thought snowflake was it's own pattern (not LP roan) and I usually saw "varnish" clumped with "roan" all the time to describe "Appy Roan"

Must drive you crazy!

bnwalker2 · 11-03-2009, 04:41 PM

Thanks guys!

11-02-2009, 04:58 AM	#1
bnwalker2 Senior Member+ Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Sunman, Indiana Posts: 7,404 Images: 84	Appaloosa color/pattern help needed! I'm helping a neighbor sell this horse, and I have NO idea what color to say she is, LOL. Parents aren't known. She is 4 years old. I can go get more detailed pictures if needed. __________________ ~Britni~ and: Halo - 5/19/09 - Quarter Horse filly Nacera - 4/22/89 Arabian mare Vega - 5/28/09 - Arabian filly Rain - 4/25/05 - Appaloosa mare I Have Been Gobbled by Thom Turkey!!!

11-02-2009, 05:49 AM	#2
FarFromOver Senior Member+ Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Here :P Posts: 4,503	No idea but she's neat looking! __________________ My horse's feet are as swift as rolling thunder He carries me away from all my fears And when the world threatens to fall asunder His mane is there to wipe away my tears. ~Bonnie Lewis

11-02-2009, 09:45 AM	#5
ACCphotography Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lexington, KY Posts: 10,276 Images: 1	Seal brown snowflake with varnish IMO. __________________ ACC 10,000 posts!!! (achieved on 11/09/09) First green star!!! (achieved on 01/17/09) Mod's nickname for me: "That's Not the Color!" (presented on 04/01/09) "We're not going to Guam are we?"

11-02-2009, 12:28 PM	#7
ACCphotography Senior Member+ Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Lexington, KY Posts: 10,276 Images: 1	So you're saying varnish is merely a STAGE of LP roaning as opposed to the name of LP roaning itself? Just making sure I understand you. __________________ ACC 10,000 posts!!! (achieved on 11/09/09) First green star!!! (achieved on 01/17/09) Mod's nickname for me: "That's Not the Color!" (presented on 04/01/09) "We're not going to Guam are we?"

11-03-2009, 04:41 PM	#10
bnwalker2 Senior Member+ Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Sunman, Indiana Posts: 7,404 Images: 84	Thanks guys! __________________ ~Britni~ and: Halo - 5/19/09 - Quarter Horse filly Nacera - 4/22/89 Arabian mare Vega - 5/28/09 - Arabian filly Rain - 4/25/05 - Appaloosa mare I Have Been Gobbled by Thom Turkey!!!

11-02-2009, 06:32 AM	#4
Eastowest Senior Member+ Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Michigan Posts: 495 Images: 26	I would say snowflake roan as far as pattern.... chestnut is the closest as far as what her base color LOOKS like to the average observer-- but I would be curious how she tests for E and A because as has been discussed here, the LP gene can mess around with the appearance of base colors, including causing a really "faded" look to black pigment.. and the dark chocolate on her legs, mane roots, and the goldness around her muzzle and eyes make me wonder if she really might be bay or brown.... but calling her that in an ad would just confuse people! LOL Laura Lyon Eastowest http://www.eastowest.com

11-02-2009, 12:21 PM	#6
Eastowest Senior Member+ Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Michigan Posts: 495 Images: 26	This is not directed at you ACC, as I am seeing more people on discussion lists using the term the way you do, and it seems to be becoming "standard usage" (especially among non-Appaloosa people)--but this seems like as good an opportunity as any to say that, as a long-time Appaloosa owner/breeder/enthusiast, I dislike using the term "varnish roan" for any and all expressions of appaloosa/LP roaning. To me, thats what roaning seen on an Appaloosa is-- LP roan, or appaloosa roan. A "varnish" roan is called that for a specific reason--the LP roaning has progressed to the point and in a manner that "varnishing" is apparent--- ie, the roaning has "left out" darker areas. (Particularly on the bony prominences of the horse's body.) Like this. NOT all LP- roaning horses roan enough/in a manner which shows "varnishing"-- and unless/until they do, I am not gonna call them "varnish roans". There. I feel better now. Laura Lyon Eastowest http://www.eastowest.com

11-02-2009, 12:37 PM	#8
Eastowest Senior Member+ Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Michigan Posts: 495 Images: 26	I see "varnish roan" like I see "snowflake roan"-- as a description of what the LP-roaning coat looks like on whatever particular horse at that time. Some LP roans never develop snowflakes, some LP roans never develop varnishing. Varnishing might be considered a "stage", yes, because if an LP roan horse roans "enough", it is most likely to appear varnished-- however there are Appaloosas that live a long life as LP roans that never show that stage of roaning. Laura Lyon Eastowest http://www.eastowest.com

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