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Discuss *8/24 Update!* Oh Please Dont Let It Be That at the Horse Health forum - Horse Forums.

Originally Posted by BigDreamsRanch I love how this thread has over 600 views but yet ...
  1. #31
    slc
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigDreamsRanch View Post
    I love how this thread has over 600 views but yet only 27 comments and I'm sure that there a plenty of people who are stalking this thread.

    Dose anyone else have an idea now that I have updated this or is everyone just waiting, and waiting, and waiting like me.
    I think that there isn't much information to go on, just 'she was lame, then she wasn't, then she was', there's no video of the lameness, and people love to look at a video and guess what leg it is and from the video, tell you what the lameness is - the only thing I really believe works, is to get the horse to a good veterinary lameness specialist and get a diagnosis, and then treat the horse based on the diagnosis. Us guessing, you guessing, the farrier guessing, that don't work too good.

    At this point it's been going on for about four months - I hate to say it, and I know how it sounds, but you need to be a whole lot more aggressive with this kind of thing. After four months of basically no treatment, almost anything is going to be more of a problem than it initially was.

    I'd suggest you prepare yourself for a long layup of this horse with some time spent every day treating, rehabbing, whatever is needed and then a gradual return to work, which from your description, that isn't what you did.

    And I stand by my previous comments about longeing a lame or even a rehabilitating horse. If a vet recommended longeing for a lame horse or a horse being rehabbed from lameness, I'd be very wary. Sometimes one has to for a minute or two in order to diagnose, but beyond that, no. It's constant turning, no matter what the size of the circle. I can't think of anything that would be good for - though some minor things might heal in spite of it rather than because of it. Straight lines - either walking in hand or riding at a walk, are the usual first steps. Depending on what was wrong and how severe it was, the gradual, stepwise return to work might be two weeks, or two months, or six months....every situation is different.

    As far as the lump on the jaw, that needs to be seen immediately. It could be a fracture, abcess or infection, they're not always hot or soft or firm.
    "He's lame. I'm not very sure what caused it but it deff. something with his legs"

    "I know! She was coughin' her brains out! And still, she had to keep singing!"' - Cher, "Moonstruck"

  2. #32
    Senior Member+ BigDreamsRanch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bay_blnd jmpr07 View Post
    I can't see the pic. But I would start hot packing for 15-20 minutes twice a day. Really, she needs antibiotics too. What's her temp been? On one hand it's good the lump hasn't gotten bigger. Has the feeling of it changed? And on the other hand, it's bad that it hasn't gotten better in a week. It needs help.

    Is this leg specialist coming to look at her legs only?
    I will try to get the picture to work when I get back from church. The feeling hasn't changed and no the leg specialist isn't coming to just look at her legs. He doesn't just do legs, that's just the area he is most advanced in.

    I'am 100% completely aware that the lump needs immediate attention but that appointment was the only one that was open.
    An ant has no quarrel with a boot.
    What's the matter, scared of a little lightning? I'm not overly fond of what follows...
    Ooh. It burns you to have come so close.

  3. #33
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    Find another one, find another vet, trailer her to another vet, you need to find out what it is. Anything from a fungal infection in the bone to a splinter. As an old timer once told me, 'If you don't know what it is, hitch up the trailer and gas up the truck'.
    "He's lame. I'm not very sure what caused it but it deff. something with his legs"

    "I know! She was coughin' her brains out! And still, she had to keep singing!"' - Cher, "Moonstruck"

  4. #34
    Senior Member+ BigDreamsRanch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slc View Post
    Find another one, find another vet, trailer her to another vet, you need to find out what it is. Anything from a fungal infection in the bone to a splinter. As an old timer once told me, 'If you don't know what it is, hitch up the trailer and gas up the truck'.
    This is the THIRD vet that will be coming out to look at her, and this is the SECOND vet that I've called this week. I'm not just going to bring out any vet, I want to make sure that the vet I bring out is highly recommended and reputable. I'am doing everything that I can possibly do. This mare means the world to me and I guarantee you that she is getting the most optimum care and that I'am doing everything I can possibly do to get a vet out here. I'am more stressed and frustrated then you are. I had an appointment planned for last Wednesday(different vet then the leg specialist) and due to no fault of my own he didn't show up, nor call. Now that is NOT my fault, I had no control over that and I promise you that I will never use that vet again. With me you only get one chance, messed it up and your gone.

    I think that there isn't much information to go on, just 'she was lame, then she wasn't, then she was', there's no video of the lameness, and people love to look at a video and guess what leg it is and from the video, tell you what the lameness is - the only thing I really believe works, is to get the horse to a good veterinary lameness specialist and get a diagnosis, and then treat the horse based on the diagnosis. Us guessing, you guessing, the farrier guessing, that don't work too good.

    At this point it's been going on for about four months - I hate to say it, and I know how it sounds, but you need to be a whole lot more aggressive with this kind of thing. After four months of basically no treatment, almost anything is going to be more of a problem than it initially was.

    I'd suggest you prepare yourself for a long layup of this horse with some time spent every day treating, rehabbing, whatever is needed and then a gradual return to work, which from your description, that isn't what you did.

    And I stand by my previous comments about longeing a lame or even a rehabilitating horse. If a vet recommended longeing for a lame horse or a horse being rehabbed from lameness, I'd be very wary. Sometimes one has to for a minute or two in order to diagnose, but beyond that, no. It's constant turning, no matter what the size of the circle. I can't think of anything that would be good for - though some minor things might heal in spite of it rather than because of it. Straight lines - either walking in hand or riding at a walk, are the usual first steps. Depending on what was wrong and how severe it was, the gradual, stepwise return to work might be two weeks, or two months, or six months....every situation is different.

    As far as the lump on the jaw, that needs to be seen immediately. It could be a fracture, abcess or infection, they're not always hot or soft or firm.
    I'am not looking for advice on the leg, I was simply giving those who have been following Rose's prognosis an update on how she's doing. That summary that I wrote was only some of what we have been doing. I didn't want to bore you with words. We have been doing some heavy treatment on her. This mare is worth over $20,000 so she will be getting the best treatment no matter what, even if I don't have the funds for it. She always comes first, I wouldn't hesitate to sell my house if it could save her.

    As for the gradual work, I did exactly what the vet said to do. Trotting and walking in a 100ft(diameter) circle shouldn't hurt her. I got some very strict instructions and a lot of "don't do's". If you disagree with super LIGHT lunging then what do you want me to do? Do you want me to ride her? In my opinion that's the worse thing one could do. Do you want me to retire her? Do you want to to continue to hand walk her even though that's what I've been doing this entire time? Should I put her in hydrotherapy even though that could really be an over load on her muscles(considering she's been off). Options are limited.

    Also for next year, it appears that she will be getting the year off and NOT due to any injury, due to a new career path for her.
    An ant has no quarrel with a boot.
    What's the matter, scared of a little lightning? I'm not overly fond of what follows...
    Ooh. It burns you to have come so close.

  5. #35
    Senior Member+ BigDreamsRanch's Avatar
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    Here's the picture again, lets see if it works:

    Blue- soft, liquid feeling
    Green- slight'y hard-ish and vein below it noticeable

    She is completely normal other than the swelling. Not draw to size.


    An ant has no quarrel with a boot.
    What's the matter, scared of a little lightning? I'm not overly fond of what follows...
    Ooh. It burns you to have come so close.

  6. #36
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    If she still hasn't had a temp.... I think it is something that has irritated her, like the foxtail I mentioned. That is the same place my mare swelled up. Mine also would have swelling up into her cheeks.

    My mare didn't stay swollen for that long, but it would make sense that one could... if the irritant persists and hasn't been removed or if she is still eating whatever spiky thing is still irritating her.


    Did you find the Eqqus article I mentioned? It is the August 2012 issue, called Case Report: Something They Ate.
    In no other department of human knowledge has there been such a universal and persistent habit of misrepresenting the truth of history as in matters relating to the horse. -John H. Wallace

    Where would we be without AGRICULTURE? Naked and hungry. Go thank a farmer.


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    If she doesnt have a temp i doubt it is strangles but you never know so isolate the horse from everyone else. Bleach and disinfect after handling her. Keep an eye for snotty nose, take temp twice a day. If she does start showing a temp keep track and start taking temps more often. If her temperature gets over 102 then she needs 2 grams bute up to twice a day or ten cc banamine twice a day (dont combine the bute and banamine they are the same thing). If her temp is still over 102 after giving the bute/banamine (it should work for 12 hrs) then call the vet. I would get some icamethol (i know i mispelled that) paste and smear it over the lump to draw out an abcess if there is one. One the horses glands are swollen we dont start them on antibiotics to avoid complications of the abcess opening internally. The vet should be able to diagnose it and give you proper directions. If you think it could be a reaction (which it doesnt sound like since its been 5 days unless you have yet to remove what is causing it) dex would help that but im not sure if you can give dex with strangles...

  8. #38
    Senior Member+ BigDreamsRanch's Avatar
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    The vet is coming out tomorrow at 1:15 p.m. I will update everyone then. Prayers are most definitely welcome!
    An ant has no quarrel with a boot.
    What's the matter, scared of a little lightning? I'm not overly fond of what follows...
    Ooh. It burns you to have come so close.

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    Finally! Hopefully it will be good news!
    BigDreamsRanch likes this.
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    "Patience is knowing it will happen and giving it time to"

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    **** Rose Update 8/22 ****

    The leg specialist came out today and a few of my fears were confirmed and other unexpected problems came to. Her leg has been blocked, and 10 x-rays were taken of various angles. She is diagnosed with a still fractured side bone, an additional fracture(of the side-bone)lower in her hoof, a fractured navicular bone to the point of almost being in half, some pretty good arthritis, and some disintegration of the coffin bone. All of it on that one right hoof, and the majority of it on the in-side.

    Plan of action taken today: coffin bone has been injected, acid as been injected for the arthritis, stabilize the hoof with a straight bar shoe and the leg specialist will becoming back out next week.

    As for the lump on her neck. He prodded it and did some tests and its nothing but muscle and excess fat from not being worked. He said that it is nothing at all and that I over reacted a bit, he then showed me how most horses with thicker necks tend to have that muscle there and to tell you the truth, once looking at more photographs of Rose she has always had some prominent muscle there, so in all..........I did over react, again.
    An ant has no quarrel with a boot.
    What's the matter, scared of a little lightning? I'm not overly fond of what follows...
    Ooh. It burns you to have come so close.

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